Are you resistant to peer pressure/groupthink?

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Pepe
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30 Jun 2020, 7:48 am

LunaticCentruroides wrote:
Seems like you’re on a good way :?:
That’s why it’s smart to only join groups, that have a similar opinion on certain values you have or that are important to you.

But if we talk about any possible social group I was accidently threw in, I personally tend to take a step back and analyze the scenario that’s going on, while they’re having their chitchat-NT-discussions. And if I feel like to and have the guts, I’ll throw in a “bomb”, to see what happens.

But yeah, I feel like the older I get, the less I’m being influenced by group thinking.


Same here,
But I may have gone a bit overboard.
I don't give much of a crap about anything anymore except getting to the Truth.
You don't get many friends that way.
But then, I'm not really fussed about that. :wink:


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kraftiekortie
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30 Jun 2020, 8:05 am

That’s a part of growing up and acquiring critical thinking skills:

The ability to resist the temptation to slavishly conform.



BenderRodriguez
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30 Jun 2020, 9:15 am

I'm allergic to tribalism and partisanship.

I'm also almost always opposed to the use of peer pressure: I understand its advantages for the group but see it as an unethical, insincere and ultimately ineffective way of keeping people in line. Disagreement and difference aren't inherently dangerous or insulting.

I also see both as a sign of weakness (power in numbers), strong individuals are more inclined to fight their own battles.

Pepe wrote:
But I'm surprised at how many on the autistic spectrum are happy to lose their individuality and join the collective of groupthinkers.
I attribute this to toxic NT social brainwashing before the ability of logical/critical thinking has been achieved.


This was one of the biggest surprises I've had on this forum, tribalism is as common as in any other environment I've been in (nota bene: not everybody does it).

I think it's more complex: some of it it's cultural/brainwashing, as you say.

I've also definitely seen it used to promote an agenda, silence dissent or merely justify personal failures and struggles, as it makes it easier to brand people as enemies, liars or traitors: it's not unusual to see people here accused of betraying their own neurology, gender etc. The ones who use it will also often push the idea that by virtue of being autistic, all of us must be exactly the same way they are.

I think there are also those who found a place they feel they belong to after a life-time of rejection and defend it exactly in the same way NTs do.

So I think some spectrumites don't think this way because it's just not how their mind works and some just never had the opportunity of being part of a group they feel is worth defending at all cost and experience the advantages, but will do the same given the chance. I'm more inclined to attribute the last two to human nature than NT culture.


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Last edited by BenderRodriguez on 30 Jun 2020, 9:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

LunaticCentruroides
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30 Jun 2020, 9:39 am

Pepe wrote:
Same here,
But I may have gone a bit overboard.
I don't give much of a crap about anything anymore except getting to the Truth.
You don't get many friends that way.
But then, I'm not really fussed about that. :wink:



I've actually caught myself sometimes giving off the impression of being "arrogant".
..Or that's at least how others percieved me. And it's a big problem for me! Since this happened more, I tend to not say things even if I know the truth. Otherwise as you said, you don't get many friends :roll:

But I think, that might be a thing for many other aspies here.



Dear_one
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30 Jun 2020, 12:03 pm

I have only had one friend who followed sports, but he didn't tell me about them. I have never owned a TV, played video games since "Tank," (the one after Pong) cared about school grades, bought a car for appearance, followed fashion, owned blue jeans, or owned a microwave. My first time in a university lecture hall, I was the guest lecturer. It is a very long time since I have set foot in a restaurant, shot a gun, eaten meat, watched a new movie, or bought alcohol. I have nothing in common with my neighbours, and am steadily being squeezed out of progressive organizations for making a distinction between gender issues and racial issues. There is a growing list of celebrities whose reason for fame eludes me. I don't hesitate to point out common errors in engineering to the engineers involved. The last time I had a regular job, I got my boss fired. After that, I was sent for a 1-week tech course, and only had to pay attention for one afternoon, about paperwork. I have gone 30 years without a car, and 4 without a 'phone, although I have them both now, on the cheap.



CockneyRebel
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01 Jul 2020, 9:55 am

I'm very resistant to those things. I have a mind of my own and I like what I like.


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Juliette
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01 Jul 2020, 11:08 am

^^^ Ditto, CR. I am VERY resistant to what others do or expect me to. One of the things I like about being on the spectrum ... the freedom to be myself. No-one would dare dictate what I can or cannot do. If someone earns my respect, then I'll do all I can to be there for them etc, but groupthink .... can't and won't do.



1986
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02 Jul 2020, 4:50 am

What is group think? I don't think it exists. People think independently but listen to others too. That's everyday life, isn't it?



Dear_one
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02 Jul 2020, 5:14 am

1986 wrote:
What is group think? I don't think it exists. People think independently but listen to others too. That's everyday life, isn't it?

In tests where a group is asked to describe something, and all but one are actors feigning the same misperception, few people are able to insist on their own truth. It is not hard to see the arc followed by thrown objects, but for over a century, artillery shells were thought to stop and drop, turning a sharp corner. I once told an author that he had promoted a stock fraud, and could I prove it with just a bit of math, but that was too much thinking for him - he trusted that someone else must have done it with different results, "because so many people can't be wrong."



1986
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02 Jul 2020, 5:23 am

Oh. But if that person was me, I wouldn't bother disagreeing as well. Arguing with people is tiresome, and disagreement leads to argument. I'd probably reconsider if it was a "12 angry men" situation, where something important was at stake, though.



Dear_one
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02 Jul 2020, 5:39 am

1986 wrote:
Oh. But if that person was me, I wouldn't bother disagreeing as well. Arguing with people is tiresome, and disagreement leads to argument. I'd probably reconsider if it was a "12 angry men" situation, where something important was at stake, though.

Yeah, I pick my battles, too. If I hear that heavy cars "hold the road better" I seldom suggest buying a racing car and adding weight, but I'm tempted. When there's a fad for dumping ice water on people, I just watch.



Pepe
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02 Jul 2020, 5:40 am

BenderRodriguez wrote:
I'm allergic to tribalism and partisanship.

I'm also almost always opposed to the use of peer pressure: I understand its advantages for the group but see it as an unethical, insincere and ultimately ineffective way of keeping people in line. Disagreement and difference aren't inherently dangerous or insulting.

I also see both as a sign of weakness (power in numbers), strong individuals are more inclined to fight their own battles.

Pepe wrote:
But I'm surprised at how many on the autistic spectrum are happy to lose their individuality and join the collective of groupthinkers.
I attribute this to toxic NT social brainwashing before the ability of logical/critical thinking has been achieved.


This was one of the biggest surprises I've had on this forum, tribalism is as common as in any other environment I've been in (nota bene: not everybody does it).

I think it's more complex: some of it it's cultural/brainwashing, as you say.

I've also definitely seen it used to promote an agenda, silence dissent or merely justify personal failures and struggles, as it makes it easier to brand people as enemies, liars or traitors: it's not unusual to see people here accused of betraying their own neurology, gender etc. The ones who use it will also often push the idea that by virtue of being autistic, all of us must be exactly the same way they are.

I think there are also those who found a place they feel they belong to after a life-time of rejection and defend it exactly in the same way NTs do.

So I think some spectrumites don't think this way because it's just not how their mind works and some just never had the opportunity of being part of a group they feel is worth defending at all cost and experience the advantages, but will do the same given the chance. I'm more inclined to attribute the last two to human nature than NT culture.


We will have to agree to disagree.
We, on the spectrum, tend to have different priorities.
E.G.
I don't have a natural empathy with other people,
Hence, it is easier for me to prioritise the Truth over a "friendship" which is dependent on lies to maintain that friendship.
Hoowa! :ninja: :wink:


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Pepe
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02 Jul 2020, 5:43 am

1986 wrote:
Oh. But if that person was me, I wouldn't bother disagreeing as well. Arguing with people is tiresome, and disagreement leads to argument. I'd probably reconsider if it was a "12 angry men" situation, where something important was at stake, though.


Yup.
"You can't reason with unreasonable people."
Believe me,
I've tried,
And HOW I've tried. 8O


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Pepe
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02 Jul 2020, 5:45 am

1986 wrote:
What is group think? I don't think it exists. People think independently but listen to others too. That's everyday life, isn't it?


Fnord would say: "Google is your friend."
Google: "Groupthink". :wink:


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Pepe
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02 Jul 2020, 5:53 am

LunaticCentruroides wrote:
Pepe wrote:
Same here,
But I may have gone a bit overboard.
I don't give much of a crap about anything anymore except getting to the Truth.
You don't get many friends that way.
But then, I'm not really fussed about that. :wink:



I've actually caught myself sometimes giving off the impression of being "arrogant".
..Or that's at least how others percieved me. And it's a big problem for me! Since this happened more, I tend to not say things even if I know the truth. Otherwise as you said, you don't get many friends :roll:

But I think, that might be a thing for many other aspies here.


This is quite common, for aspies.

People who don't know me think I am arrogant.
Can't be further from the Truth.
I actually use satire to mock arrogant people.
I am not "Ego Driven".

Some people simply mistake being self-involved,
And having a strong opinion,
In defiance of groupthink,
As "Arrogance".

Erm
Except for Fnord.
He really is arrogant. <joke>
I really do like the man and his "Interesting" ways. :wink:


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Dear_one
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02 Jul 2020, 6:22 am

Oh, I almost forgot - I also reject the Stone-Age health food (meat) despite its continued popularity in a time with trade and preservation that leads to distinctly longer, healthier lives. The trouble is that I can't go to the hospital without being surrounded by people who think nothing of killing animals. I find it hard to trust them.