What's your opinion on physical punishment for kids

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salad
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26 Jun 2021, 2:37 pm

I hope to get married to my fiancee pretty soon and this is something I always think about as someone who was raised in a culture where physical violence and hitting kids was so normal it was considered strange if your parents didn't beat you up. For me my father used to belt me across the face growing up all the time, and my mother used to spank me with the wooden spoon or hit me hard with the shoe whenever she was upset at me. My stepfather used the cane on me growing up a lot whenever he believed I acted up. My martial arts teacher and sensei used to beat me with his bamboo stick whenever I went out of stance, and my Muslim instructors used to beat me up whenever I made a mistake

The sum total of all of these beatings is that despite being a naturally shy autistic kid who would otherwise be a crybaby and a softie I was molded into a tough and disciplined person who can hold his own really well in tough situations despite being autistic and naturally sensitive. My nature isn't tough, nor am I naturally resilient; my upbringing and nurturing was tough and thats what hardened me to be tough. Being autistic the yelling, hitting and beatings definitely hurt me 1000 times harder than a neurotypical dealing with it since I naturally am sensitive to pain, yet even shy autistic me eventually became inured to the pain became desensitized to said pain despite my autism predisposing me to being a lot more sensitive to pain

I was wondering given all the research that argues hitting kids is ineffective for parenting whether that's really true. Sure it was traumatizing but it made me a lot tougher and stronger than had I been raised with softness and gentleness.

Not even just me but generations ago parents used to regularly beat their kids and many turned out just fine. Generations ago people were tougher and harder, which explains why the older generation is a lot tougher and stronger than the younger generation.


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funeralxempire
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26 Jun 2021, 2:53 pm

salad wrote:
Not even just me but generations ago parents used to regularly beat their kids and many turned out just fine. Generations ago people were tougher and harder, which explains why the older generation is a lot tougher and stronger than the younger generation.


And they all had unresolved mental health concerns as a result that their great-grandkids will be dealing with the repercussions of.


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Last edited by funeralxempire on 26 Jun 2021, 2:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Shadow1888
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26 Jun 2021, 2:53 pm

Personally I find hitting your child to be wrong no matter who you are or where you come from.
But growing up I would get hit here and there but it didn't discipline me in the slightest, it was basically my parents way of struggling to cope with me and take out their frustration.
it was mostly mental abusive I received, which to be honest i find a lot worse.
Children play up all the time as it is why our job is to teach them right from wrong and how to treat people and vice versa.
My eldest stepson was raised without beating him and he is a strong, independent and loving person for it.
So to answer your question from my perspective, have patience and do your best for them as children learn from their parents and it will shape them into becoming who they will be.



maycontainthunder
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26 Jun 2021, 3:01 pm

My father would hit me for pretty much any reason or none at all.

Physical punishment has a limited place but I am uncertain where the line must be drawn but don't be like my father.


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26 Jun 2021, 4:52 pm

Apart from it being illegal in my country, I find it useless.
You as an adult set the frames, from being apreciative of good behaviour to punishing bad.
If you hit your child when it misbehaves it will learn that unless you hit it all is good.
If you stop talking to your child when it misbehaves it will learn that that means it has done something wrong.
And being rough on your child doesn't make it tough, it makes it insecure.

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HeroOfHyrule
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26 Jun 2021, 5:14 pm

salad wrote:
...Sure it was traumatizing but it made me a lot tougher and stronger than had I been raised with softness and gentleness...

...Not even just me but generations ago parents used to regularly beat their kids and many turned out just fine....

Genuine question, is this a joke? I don't get how something you admit was "traumatizing" is good for anyone, or makes them "turn out just fine".

Anyways, I got over being shy as an autistic kid without getting my ass beat. People sometimes say I'm very assertive, and even though that's probably partly from emotional/mental abuse, I'd be 100x more shy and submissive if I had the crap beat out of me in addition to that.

In general I just don't think anyone should lay their hands on kids if they want to raise a well mannered adult. Whenever I have to deal with children I think about what behaviour I'd want them to display towards others when they're an adult, and it's pretty easy to come to the conclusion that I'm not comfortable teaching children that it's appropriate to hit other people.


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DW_a_mom
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26 Jun 2021, 9:31 pm

Salad, you've hit on one of the most controversial topics out there.

Numerous studies have shown that, on average, children raised in households that use corporal punishment have WORSE outcomes. More likely to get in trouble with the law, most likely to end up in jail, more likely to resort to violence. But there remain millions of people out there who are completely convinced that all of society's problems are the result of parents not spanking their kids.

Long run, I personally do not believe that whether or not a parent includes spanking in their discipline tool box is the most important factor. Far more important are the difficult tasks of providing clarity and consistency to your children. Children need structure, they need to test their boundaries and see consistent consequences, and they need to feel safe in their environments. If a child understands the consequence for action B is going to be a spanking, and he gets a spanking for action B, the child seems to be able to reconcile and understand what has happened. It can be almost comforting to know that that everything happened exactly as expected, which might be why so many kids of spanking families will share their mischief stories with laughter as adults. But If the child believes action B isn't the same as action A, engages in action A but gets the consequences set for action B, he will be confused and fearful. As many ASD individuals have posted on this board, the most distressing issue they faced growing up was that they weren't able to understand why their actions connected to the consequences meted out by their parents. That is a devastating failure on the part of the parents, and creates atmosphere of fear and distrust, that can only be worsened by the presence of physical violence in the formula.

Personally, and as backed up by science, I don't think physical consequences are necessary and I don't think they make anyone tough. People are socially conditioned to believe they will, but they don't.

A parent can, however, "weaken" a child by never issuing consequences of any type. Threatening consequences, but never following through, is another common parenting mistake.

One of the most fascinating discoveries I made when my children were little was the power of the count down. I think the first few times I used it, the threat was something like "if you don't put your coat on by the count of 10 I will do it for you." Pretty mild, but young children HATE losing their autonomy. After just one or two of those simple and clear threats carried out, I discovered that in almost any situation all I had to do was say "you have until the count of 10." I got lazy about finishing the sentence with what the consequence was going to be simply because the act of counting made them take me seriously and jump into action. Every parent I know says the same thing. All you have to do 90% of the time is start counting. I think for my kids it was the signal of the difference between what I wanted them to do, v. what I needed them to do and was prepared to enforce in any way necessary. The important thing is how well it WORKED.

I was a "no spanking" parent. That does not mean I didn't provide discipline and consequences, but I never spanked, and the feedback I received from society was that I had my children well in hand. The families in my circle were mostly all similar; our kids were "good" and we didn't spank. The amusing thing was how many people who believe in spanking assumed I was a spanking parent based on how well my children behaved. I had fun "shocking" them by telling them I did not believe in spanking. But I do have a few friends who used the tool of spanking carefully and infrequently and they raised good kids, too, because they excelled at the clarity and consistency golden rule and knew how to pick their battles, as well.

If you fail at clarity and consistency, it won't matter what tools you choose to use. The odds of poor results with your children increase dramatically.

I have to admit, clarity and consistency are HARD. You'll be surprised by how difficult it can be to stay cool, collected and consistent in some situations. But the effort to do so is worth it.


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salad
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26 Jun 2021, 10:14 pm

If I sounded drunk or stupid writing this thread I apologize. Head injuries making me feel stupid. its hard to explain what the effects of these head injuries does to my brain and intelligence, but it feels like my brain is at 10% capacity


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auntblabby
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26 Jun 2021, 10:21 pm

in general, violence begets violence.



funeralxempire
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26 Jun 2021, 10:25 pm

salad wrote:
If I sounded drunk or stupid writing this thread I apologize. Head injuries making me feel stupid. its hard to explain what the effects of these head injuries does to my brain and intelligence, but it feels like my brain is at 10% capacity


They're relatable. :oops:


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27 Jun 2021, 12:59 am

But don't you have distress still from your father beating on you? Sure maybe it forced you to like become tougher or what not, but in a lot of your posts it seems like that stuff actually did harm you, like sometimes seems like you get stuck in the idea of having to be tough that you may even put yourself in unnecessary harm. So mean can you really say the beatings you got as a kid, really helped you develop? Cause idk seems you are terrified of expressing emotion like crying or things like that and that is kind of its own prison.



Danusaurus
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27 Jun 2021, 2:06 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
But don't you have distress still from your father beating on you? Sure maybe it forced you to like become tougher or what not, but in a lot of your posts it seems like that stuff actually did harm you, like sometimes seems like you get stuck in the idea of having to be tough that you may even put yourself in unnecessary harm. So mean can you really say the beatings you got as a kid, really helped you develop? Cause idk seems you are terrified of expressing emotion like crying or things like that and that is kind of its own prison.


I was having a thought on this earlier. I think the saying is something like bullied people quite often repeat this on others though I'm not sure if it's a way of coping or similar.
Not letting people deal with these issues will permanently change them .. for the worse!



GGPViper
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27 Jun 2021, 2:13 am

As I recall, my father has permanent damage to his hearing on one ear from being slapped by *his* father as a child.



auntblabby
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27 Jun 2021, 2:26 am

the drummer of the beach boys long ago, had a similar hearing deficit from a similar abuse by his "father."



Sweetleaf
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27 Jun 2021, 2:39 am

Danusaurus wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
But don't you have distress still from your father beating on you? Sure maybe it forced you to like become tougher or what not, but in a lot of your posts it seems like that stuff actually did harm you, like sometimes seems like you get stuck in the idea of having to be tough that you may even put yourself in unnecessary harm. So mean can you really say the beatings you got as a kid, really helped you develop? Cause idk seems you are terrified of expressing emotion like crying or things like that and that is kind of its own prison.


I was having a thought on this earlier. I think the saying is something like bullied people quite often repeat this on others though I'm not sure if it's a way of coping or similar.
Not letting people deal with these issues will permanently change them .. for the worse!


Well or they go the other way and internalize it all...that is more what kinda happened with me. Like sure a couple times I did bully other people as a reaction to like getting bullied myself because like I wanted to see what it was that made them want to do it...but the one time I did I just felt so bad for participating in the bullying even though at the time I took part like kinda from peer pressure...after the fact I felt really bad about it, it just felt so dirty and gross idk so yeah I did not figure what thrill maybe some people get from bullying because yeah I felt absolutely horrid the one time I joined in the bullying of a singled out person. I mean well I felt so bad that this happened when I am a kid and 20 years later I am still feeling bad about it.



salad
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27 Jun 2021, 2:45 am

I made this thread while my brain was still messed up from gluten poisoning and feeling like an idiot from head trauma issues that are ongoing and hope to get more treatment for this Tuesday. I'm realizing now that I wasnt thinking while making this thread because I said some pretty stupid stuff

My dad beating me up made me tougher, but it also made me more bitter, angry, and out of balance and deprived of inner peace. The beatings from my instructors and martial arts teachers I dont mind actually since it genuinely turned me into a more disciplined person and they beat me out of love, but my father who used to beat me was abusive and beat me to terrorize me.

If I made any comment in this thread insinuating that my dad beating me up was beneficial I retract it. Most days because of head pain and dizziness I feel stupid so sometimes I say stuff which when I look back I realize I didnt mean

But i still dont mind the hits i took from my teachers and mom since it wasnt abusive and only meant to teach me a lesson


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