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Do you believe in Simulation Theory?
Yes - I think we are RPG (we control the character, from outside the simulation.) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Yes - I think we are all Artificial Intelligences, who only think we exist as nature creatures. 9%  9%  [ 1 ]
No - I think we exist is base reality. 91%  91%  [ 10 ]
Total votes : 11

sitko
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14 Jun 2021, 9:47 am

Hi,

I believe in simulation theory, that we are either NPCs or RPGs, in our reality.

I'll present my bits of evidence in replies, and feel free to add your two cents...

Note: You WILL be able to change your vote in the poll, after I've convinced you.

I look forward to your thoughts, ideas and questions.



sitko
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14 Jun 2021, 9:50 am

Evidence: The Double Slit Experiment.

If you are not aware of this famous experiment, please go to YouTube an watch a video on it.

What this shows us, is reality's nature is dependent on someone seeing it.

Here's a good video explaining it:

https://youtu.be/A9tKncAdlHQ

There's an obnoxious ad right at the end of the video, please watch through that ad, because the end of the video is the really weird bit, that will shock you.



Last edited by sitko on 14 Jun 2021, 10:53 am, edited 2 times in total.

naturalplastic
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14 Jun 2021, 9:52 am

We are all simulated characters in a game of farmville being played on a desktop computer by a pudgy kid in his parents' basement, who is himself ...a character in a game of Farmville, being played by a bigger...pudgy kid on a computer in his parents' basement in a bigger universe...which is a simulation being run on a smart phone belonging to a schoolgirl on a school bus in an even bigger universe...which is...



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14 Jun 2021, 9:55 am

Evidence: The Fermi Paradox solution.

The Fermi Paradox speaks to if the Universe is so big, then why haven't we seen any evidence of life in the Universe. Surely a Death star would be visible on the Hubble? One of the solutions to the paradox is that we live in a simulation that is only programmed for one planet. Ironically, recently, the US government has declassified reports of true UFOs, they are clear to say, that they don't think they are of extraterrestrial origin, but they don't know do they, they are UFOs.

Maybe the simulation creators have decided to add UFOs to the mix recently, and added this into the simulation.



sitko
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14 Jun 2021, 9:56 am

naturalplastic wrote:
We are all simulated characters in a game of farmville being played on a desktop computer by a pudgy kid in his parents' basement, who is himself ...a character in a game of Farmville, being played by a bigger...pudgy kid on a computer in his parents' basement in a bigger universe...which is a simulation being run on a smart phone belonging to a schoolgirl on a school bus in an even bigger universe...which is...


Turtles all the way down?



naturalplastic
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14 Jun 2021, 10:23 am

sitko wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
We are all simulated characters in a game of farmville being played on a desktop computer by a pudgy kid in his parents' basement, who is himself ...a character in a game of Farmville, being played by a bigger...pudgy kid on a computer in his parents' basement in a bigger universe...which is a simulation being run on a smart phone belonging to a schoolgirl on a school bus in an even bigger universe...which is...


Turtles all the way down?


Exactly !
:lol:

Or more accurately "turtles all of the way UP".



Last edited by naturalplastic on 14 Jun 2021, 12:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Aspiegaming
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14 Jun 2021, 11:23 am

I have this idea that outside our universe is some kind of observatory. In a room with a large window observing our planet is a terminal. Typing commands into this terminal will effect our planet and universe. It's been abandoned for quite a lot of time.


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14 Jun 2021, 11:31 am

I don't think I'd buy into a literal read of it such as Matrix or Thirteenth Floor.

What I'm a lot more in tune with and sympathetic to is the idea that our own brains may be constructing space and time as a user interface from such a thin cherry-picked layer of reality that by all intense and purposes it's virtual. This is along the Donald Hoffman line that nature doesn't select for animals, creatures, or agents that see veridical truth but rather it selects for those who maximize their access to fitness payouts - procreative potential being the biggest. It's part of why our world, especially in the west, seems to be consummately obsessed with social climbing and cutthroat competition with only enough regard to truth to where it aids winning zero-sum games, that's how you win the game of life in the physiological sense.

I often find myself listening to a lot of the NDE accounts and stuck in a bit of a bind. In one sense it could be that, lets use the language of universal Darwinism vs. cooperative superclusters, that the bulk of existence could be a cooperative supercluster (ie. where the most vigorous action 'out there' is simply play) where in this very specific hypergraph (borrowing from Wolfram) we have harsh Darwinian competition, nature red in tooth and nail, etc.. What really sucks is that it seems as though so much in the way of 'paranormal' experiences people will have seem to be built on the same principal - ie. universal Darwinism - in that they're nonphysical creatures, or perhaps strange nonlocal extension of physical ones that we can't pin down a relationship to, which are doing their own version of grifting the unsuspecting. In a way that ties out well when one initially assumes that it's all BS and fantasies of weak people (ie. root assumption being reductive materialism, eliminativism or strong emergence with respect to consciousness), one has a strong enough set of experiences to shake them out of reductive materialism, but then they're forced to come to grips with the idea that the experiences themselves are real but the contents of many of them are BS of the sort that one would expect where everything is foraging for food at something else's expense. The question then - is there any layer of the story that we can trust not to be predatory? Are NDE's a place where we're actually seeing the start of something where there's some degree of integrity? It seems to be a mixed bag.

This is where I really would love to see where someone can really nail down the zones, ie. the phase transition from universal Darwinism to cooperative supercluster or whole cooperative universe. I haven't heard Hoffman or Prakash take a stab at it, I haven't heard Bernardo Kastrup or even Tom Campbell take a stab at it (maybe Tom has and I just haven't seen the right video), and while I love the nuts and bolts that Karl Friston lays down I notice that PCM really tries to shy away from even panpsychism. Then there's Andres Gomez Emilsson who seems to be right in the middle where he'd consider himself both a physicalist and a panpsychist, has a lot of what I think are really robust theories of what psychedelics are, how various strata of consciousness works, but again the trouble with me for physicalism - it has to be able to account for things like robust NDE information, reincarnation, etc. and maybe at some point it will in the next couple decades but it still seems like a lot of that is still in the 'woo' zone where you can easily burn your degree and go drive a cab somewhere if you touch it.


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14 Jun 2021, 10:06 pm

While I believe that simulation theory could be possible (it is very similar to reincarnation beliefs), it doesn't exactly explain how we got here to begin with.

When I heard about it as a child, it was always used as a theory to explain how the universe was possibly created...but if this universe was created by someone on the outside, then how did that "outside" universe get created??


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sitko
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15 Jun 2021, 11:30 am

SabbraCadabra wrote:
While I believe that simulation theory could be possible (it is very similar to reincarnation beliefs), it doesn't exactly explain how we got here to begin with.

When I heard about it as a child, it was always used as a theory to explain how the universe was possibly created...but if this universe was created by someone on the outside, then how did that "outside" universe get created??


That's an interesting thought. I guess I'd answer you that, that doesn't matter to use the simulated. Does a character from a video game, care about how OUR universe was created? All they care about is their OWN universe. Let the Simulation Creators worry about that OUTSIDE universe. We (people of the simulated universe) can't begin to try and figure out the OUTSIDE universe, as we have ZERO data on it. You need to be able to observe a system to try and figure out how it works. Let's figure out our own Universe, and once we got that taken care of, we can start worrying about how the base universe was created.



sitko
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15 Jun 2021, 11:39 am

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
I don't think I'd buy into a literal read of it such as Matrix or Thirteenth Floor.

What I'm a lot more in tune with and sympathetic to is the idea that our own brains may be constructing space and time as a user interface from such a thin cherry-picked layer of reality that by all intense and purposes it's virtual.


I've heard something along these lines, that first our universe was thought to be made out of particles, then later waves, and now information. So, the universe could be very different than the universe we perceive with our minds and eyes. Maybe the Aliens are more visible in a different spectrum of light, that we can't perceive. Or maybe we just create our reality based on 'reasons' and it is what it is.

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
This is along the Donald Hoffman line that nature doesn't select for animals, creatures, or agents that see veridical (vertical?) truth but rather it selects for those who maximize their access to fitness payouts - procreative potential being the biggest. It's part of why our world, especially in the west, seems to be consummately obsessed with social climbing and cutthroat competition with only enough regard to truth to where it aids winning zero-sum games, that's how you win the game of life in the physiological sense.

I often find myself listening to a lot of the NDE accounts and stuck in a bit of a bind.


NDE?

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
In one sense it could be that, lets use the language of universal Darwinism vs. cooperative superclusters, that the bulk of existence could be a cooperative supercluster (ie. where the most vigorous action 'out there' is simply play) where in this very specific hypergraph (borrowing from Wolfram) we have harsh Darwinian competition, nature red in tooth and nail, etc..


Huh? I guess I'm not as smart as I thought I was.

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
What really sucks is that it seems as though so much in the way of 'paranormal' experiences people will have seem to be built on the same principal - ie. universal Darwinism - in that they're nonphysical creatures, or perhaps strange nonlocal extension of physical ones that we can't pin down a relationship to, which are doing their own version of grifting the unsuspecting. In a way that ties out well when one initially assumes that it's all BS and fantasies of weak people (ie. root assumption being reductive materialism, eliminativism or strong emergence with respect to consciousness), one has a strong enough set of experiences to shake them out of reductive materialism, but then they're forced to come to grips with the idea that the experiences themselves are real but the contents of many of them are BS of the sort that one would expect where everything is foraging for food at something else's expense. The question then - is there any layer of the story that we can trust not to be predatory? Are NDE's a place where we're actually seeing the start of something where there's some degree of integrity? It seems to be a mixed bag.


Please dumb this down for me.

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
This is where I really would love to see where someone can really nail down the zones, ie. the phase transition from universal Darwinism to cooperative supercluster or whole cooperative universe. I haven't heard Hoffman or Prakash take a stab at it, I haven't heard Bernardo Kastrup or even Tom Campbell take a stab at it (maybe Tom has and I just haven't seen the right video), and while I love the nuts and bolts that Karl Friston lays down I notice that PCM really tries to shy away from even panpsychism. Then there's Andres Gomez Emilsson who seems to be right in the middle where he'd consider himself both a physicalist and a panpsychist, has a lot of what I think are really robust theories of what psychedelics are, how various strata of consciousness works, but again the trouble with me for physicalism - it has to be able to account for things like robust NDE information, reincarnation, etc. and maybe at some point it will in the next couple decades but it still seems like a lot of that is still in the 'woo' zone where you can easily burn your degree and go drive a cab somewhere if you touch it.


I started to think that perhaps you were just trying to make this more complex than it is. Or you presenting a lot of information without explaining to us stupid people very well...can you elaborate? Because there's tons of names at the end of your missive, which makes me think I could look up their work, if interest was there...



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15 Jun 2021, 12:25 pm

Mere belief proves nothing.


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15 Jun 2021, 12:29 pm

NDE is an abbreviation for near death experience.


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15 Jun 2021, 1:42 pm

I believe I am the Wolfman, and that my existence isn't "simulated."



sitko
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15 Jun 2021, 3:11 pm

Fnord wrote:
Mere belief proves nothing.


I'm listing my evidence points in the discussion. But, without belief, you couldn't have religions or other things. It's a start.

Here's a good video that goes through these points a bit as well...
https://youtu.be/I_KJKEYoaoo



Last edited by sitko on 15 Jun 2021, 3:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

sitko
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15 Jun 2021, 3:12 pm

VegetableMan wrote:
NDE is an abbreviation for near death experience.

Thanks.