Божий суд над великой блудницей

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QFT
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SkinnedWolf
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20 May 2022, 3:02 pm

I don't think a Russian video without subtitles would have much value here.

And that seems to mean you know Russian?

If you want to gain opinions, it can be helpful to write a summary of the translated version.

The comment section of the video was rather interesting and had a culture shock on me.
And the Russians seem to be interested in Texas.

I'm curious if russians need a VPN to access youtube.


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kraftiekortie
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20 May 2022, 3:04 pm

Who's the "Great Harlot?"



SkinnedWolf
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20 May 2022, 3:06 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Who's the "Great Harlot?"

Depending on the context, I'd be surprised if that didn't refer to the US.


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roronoa79
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20 May 2022, 3:23 pm

Божий суд над великой блудницей
Translates to
God's judgment of the Great Harlot

The Great Harlot here referring to the figure from the Biblical Book of Revelations--here used as a metaphor for the US or the West in general. My Russian is not good enough to translate the whole video.


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Δυνατὰ δὲ οἱ προύχοντες πράσσουσι καὶ οἱ ἀσθενεῖς ξυγχωροῦσιν
Those with power do what their power permits, while the weak have no choice but to accept it.

- Thucydides


kraftiekortie
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20 May 2022, 3:27 pm

Most of the comments are anti-American.

My iPhone translates text amazingly well.



kraftiekortie
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20 May 2022, 3:44 pm

It doesn't matter. People are entitled to their opinion.

But no American would take kindly to some person speaking about some sort of "divine retribution" for the USA.

I certainly wouldn't do that pertaining to Russia.



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20 May 2022, 4:02 pm

It's interesting how radical political propaganda is combined with fanatical religious fervor.

As someone who has only lived in areas that is overwhelmingly atheist, this is a sample I rarely see.
The ones I've seen are more moderate and...comical.


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Last edited by SkinnedWolf on 20 May 2022, 4:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.

kraftiekortie
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20 May 2022, 4:03 pm

This is, actually, a very common phenomenon.

And it has been for centuries.

This sort of thing was especially virulent in medieval and early modern times.



Last edited by kraftiekortie on 20 May 2022, 4:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

SkinnedWolf
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20 May 2022, 4:06 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
This is, actually, a very common phenomenon.

And it is been for centuries.

Hmmm...China has always been special in this regard.


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kraftiekortie
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20 May 2022, 4:08 pm

Correct me if I'm wrong: it's a very similar thing in Chinese history, minus much of the "religious" factor.

Everything else is quite similar when comparing European and Chinese history.



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20 May 2022, 4:42 pm

SkinnedWolf wrote:
It's interesting how radical political propaganda is combined with fanatical religious fervor.

As someone who has only lived in areas that is overwhelmingly atheist, this is a sample I rarely see.
The ones I've seen are more moderate and...comical.

Russian nationalism has been tied to Orthodox Christianity (ie: the Orthodox Church) for centuries. Before the Soviets, the Russian Tsar's authoritarian rule was justified as being the will of God. (Sort of like the Mandate of Heaven in Imperial China, though not exactly the same). The Tsar ruled by Divine Right, ie: God made him tsar, so God wants him to be tsar and you should never question him or you question God.
After the Bolshevik Revolution, the state became explicitly atheist, but many Russians still believed in God and that God wanted for Russia to be ruled by a tsar.
After the collapse of the USSR, Russian nationalists ruling the Russian Federation have brought back this rhetoric that Russia is great because God wills it and that the secular West is anti-Christian and therefore anti-Russian. You see this kind of rhetoric in a lot of Christian nationalist groups in Europe and the Americas.

Part of why communists and socialists were so hostile to religion was because kings and emperors would use the church to tell people that God wanted them to support the king. Hence why Marx characterized religion as "the opiate of the masses"--a drug pushed on the people by kings who wanted complacent, loyal, dependent subjects.


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Δυνατὰ δὲ οἱ προύχοντες πράσσουσι καὶ οἱ ἀσθενεῖς ξυγχωροῦσιν
Those with power do what their power permits, while the weak have no choice but to accept it.

- Thucydides


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20 May 2022, 4:45 pm

SkinnedWolf wrote:
I don't think a Russian video without subtitles would have much value here.
And that seems to mean you know Russian?
I had always suspected the OP was a Russian sympathiser.



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20 May 2022, 5:04 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Correct me if I'm wrong: it's a very similar thing in Chinese history, minus much of the "religious" factor.

Everything else is quite similar when comparing European and Chinese history.

In my opinion, ancient Chinese history is very different from ancient European history.


In terms of religion, ancient Chinese religions were all quite pragmatic and secular.
Taoism, the native Chinese religion, promotes seclusion and alchemy, and is not keen on recruiting members, so it is quite peaceful.
During the Tang Dynasty(618AD-907AD), Buddhism was violently suppressed by the emperor because it led to land annexation. This is likely the reason for the secularization of ancient Chinese religions.

Those violent cult-like revolutions themselves were only part of the bloody peasant revolution—the latter of which is not uncommon in Chinese history. This is closer to ancient superstition than a systematic religion. And it's hard to tell exactly which religion they're using.
Folk superstitions in China are often so mixed with Buddhism and Taoism that they cannot form any system.

Although individual emperors have shown interest in Buddhism, China has never had any form of unity of state and religion.
China from the Han Dynasty(202BC-220AD) used the idea of "on the surface Confucianism, but in fact Legalism" to govern, but this is closer to ideology than religion.


In terms of political power, since the Qin Dynasty (221-207), the feudal era in the European sense ended in China. Most of the time the main body of China was a unified dynasty, and most of the remaining time was divided into two parts, north and south, due to ethnic groups. Sorting into more parts only in a very short time.
In such large regimes, centralization continued to be strengthened until it reached its peak during the Qing Dynasty (1636-1912). In this case, the whole country belongs to the emperor: The emperor was highly vigilant against any domestic forces that might threaten him, and there was no clear line between "state property" and "royal property".
It wasn't until the Reform Movement of 1898 that China began trying to limit crown power, nearly three centuries after Europe.

Beginning in the Sui Dynasty (581-618), Chinese bureaucratic selection began to use examinations rather than bloodline or recommendation. This continued until the end of the Qing Dynasty. This means that most families with the slightest ambition choose to have their children do academic studies (in the Confucian sense, mainly literature and philosophy) rather than religious studies. This has led to the fervent pursuit of academic intelligence in Chinese culture.


To sum up, authoritarianism, technocratism and Confucian ideology have an important place in Chinese culture, not religion. Chinese culture does not leave much room for religion.

But I've been a STEM student since high school. My understanding of Chinese history is not systematic. This is my personal impression.


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Last edited by SkinnedWolf on 20 May 2022, 5:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

kraftiekortie
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20 May 2022, 5:14 pm

I was under the impression that civil service examinations started in the lifetime of Confucius himself.

Thanks for your commentary.

I really should read more Chinese history.



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20 May 2022, 5:19 pm

roronoa79 wrote:
After the collapse of the USSR, Russian nationalists ruling the Russian Federation have brought back this rhetoric that Russia is great because God wills it and that the secular West is anti-Christian and therefore anti-Russian. You see this kind of rhetoric in a lot of Christian nationalist groups in Europe and the Americas.

I have an impression that many of those anti-Chinese ideologies that started in the late Qing Dynasty pointed to "China is a country without Christ" (even before the PRC) rather than just "Chinese are an inferior race".

I seem to see a similar expression in the anti-Black ideology used to defend slavery.


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