Two Passengers On Fully Vaccinated Cruise Ship Test Positive

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kraftiekortie
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17 Jun 2021, 5:05 pm

He had to be......there were about 25,000 deaths from COVID in NYC during March and April of 2020.



DW_a_mom
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17 Jun 2021, 6:37 pm

Mr Reynholm wrote:
DW_a_mom wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
lostproperty wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
So if the vaccine does not provide immunity, what is the point of getting vaccinated?


It looks as though they want people to have Covid vaccines regularly. They are already talking about a 3rd jab here in the UK having just extended restrictions for a further month beyond "freedom day" (June 21st) in which case they can't claim vaccines gives you immunity, only that it offers short term protection.

If the vaccines work as well as natural immunity does, then they ought to prevent serious illness without the need for top ups until you either become old and frail or you develop other illnesses that make you vulnerable.

That they are not testing people to see if they are naturally immune and do not require a vaccine, probably says an awful lot.

It seems to be more about control than anything else.


Control of the virus, yes. Vaccinated communities can return to normal without risking nightmare scenes of mass burials and an overwhelmed medical system. Remember what it looked like during surges of the virus in hot spots? Remember how many health care workers died before they were vaccinated?

No one who is fully vaccinated via any of the vaccines approved in the US has died from virus and very few have been hospitalized. Some of the vaccines not approved in the US have a slightly less glowing record.

Where were these mass burials and overwhelmed hospitals?
Covid has a 99.6% survivability rate. Thats better odds than me surviving my commute home from work.
This entire ordeal has been about government over reach and acclimating the population to the idea of giving up their
freedom for "safety".


Either you haven't watched the news the past year or you've quickly forgotten. Freezer trucks with the dead in New York last March? Triaging care in Italy last February? Families unable to bury their dead just recently in India?

The broad range public policy goal has always been, from a totally cold perspective, about keeping the disease within the confines of what can be safely, comfortably and effectively handled by local medical systems.


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funeralxempire
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17 Jun 2021, 6:44 pm

Mr Reynholm wrote:
Covid has a 99.6% survivability rate. Thats better odds than me surviving my commute home from work.


I didn't realize your commute included the Occupied Territories. 8)


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Kitty4670
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18 Jun 2021, 2:12 am

Mr Reynholm wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
So if the vaccine does not provide immunity, what is the point of getting vaccinated?


It does not provide immunity for everyone. Pfiezer and Moderna claim a 90 to 95 percent prevention rate. Johnson and Johnson 70 percent. Last time I read nobody had died from Covid that had been vaccinated. The 7 members of the New York Yankees staff and one player that had “breakthrough cases” received the Johnson and Johnson vaccine.
All but one person were asymptomatic. The player got pretty sick.

From a selfish pint of view the point of getting vaccinated is to sharply reduce your chance of getting sick and if you do contract a breakthrough case probably be less sick sans vaccine. The more people vaccinated the more likely you have even a lesser chance of getting sick.

The risk analysis for me is that with a .06% chance of dying from Covid it seems like I'd rather rely on my natural immune system than risk any potential side effect the vaccine may have.



Did you not get the vaccination?


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Kitty4670
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18 Jun 2021, 2:29 am

I thought the covid vaccine was the cure, it only reduced symptoms in the virus? Is there no cure? Why places are open? This is more scary living like this. If it helps me, I’m taking vitamin D3 with Highest Potency, I’m also taking vitamins B with C in it, but I don’t know if I need all that, I found multi vitamins for women my age, I also found pills for eye health.


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naturalplastic
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18 Jun 2021, 2:45 am

vaccines dont "cure" anything. Vaccines prevent healthy folks from catching the disease. But they dont do anything for you if you already have the disease.

If you already have polio then shooting up with the famous Salk Polio Vaccines is not going to make your polio go away.

Vaccines just prevent you from contracting the disease in the first place.

So healthy tots today get the Salk vaccine, and it provokes their bodies to build up immunity so the tots dont contract the disease in the first place. Since no one gets polio now polio is under control now.



magz
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18 Jun 2021, 4:16 am

naturalplastic wrote:
vaccines dont "cure" anything. Vaccines prevent healthy folks from catching the disease. But they dont do anything for you if you already have the disease.

If you already have polio then shooting up with the famous Salk Polio Vaccines is not going to make your polio go away.

Vaccines just prevent you from contracting the disease in the first place.

So healthy tots today get the Salk vaccine, and it provokes their bodies to build up immunity so the tots dont contract the disease in the first place. Since no one gets polio now polio is under control now.

Some vaccines - like tenatus and rabies - can be administered after contact with the pathogen but before developing symptoms. It happens for diseases that take long time "preparing to attack", so the vaccine can work as an early alarm.

Covid vaccines are not this kind. They prevent healthy people from contracting covid, make symptoms a lot milder in "breakthrough" cases (disease contracted despite having been vaccinated) and they limit spreading of it.


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kraftiekortie
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18 Jun 2021, 6:12 am

Kids actually usually get the oral Sabin polio vaccine.

Salk’s was good—but Sabin’s was better.



Kitty4670
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21 Jun 2021, 11:08 pm

magz wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
vaccines dont "cure" anything. Vaccines prevent healthy folks from catching the disease. But they dont do anything for you if you already have the disease.

If you already have polio then shooting up with the famous Salk Polio Vaccines is not going to make your polio go away.

Vaccines just prevent you from contracting the disease in the first place.

So healthy tots today get the Salk vaccine, and it provokes their bodies to build up immunity so the tots dont contract the disease in the first place. Since no one gets polio now polio is under control now.

Some vaccines - like tenatus and rabies - can be administered after contact with the pathogen but before developing symptoms. It happens for diseases that take long time "preparing to attack", so the vaccine can work as an early alarm.

Covid vaccines are not this kind. They prevent healthy people from contracting covid, make symptoms a lot milder in "breakthrough" cases (disease contracted despite having been vaccinated) and they limit spreading of it.



So the vaccine is a cure.


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Mr Reynholm
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22 Jun 2021, 8:51 am

DW_a_mom wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
DW_a_mom wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
lostproperty wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
So if the vaccine does not provide immunity, what is the point of getting vaccinated?


It looks as though they want people to have Covid vaccines regularly. They are already talking about a 3rd jab here in the UK having just extended restrictions for a further month beyond "freedom day" (June 21st) in which case they can't claim vaccines gives you immunity, only that it offers short term protection.

If the vaccines work as well as natural immunity does, then they ought to prevent serious illness without the need for top ups until you either become old and frail or you develop other illnesses that make you vulnerable.

That they are not testing people to see if they are naturally immune and do not require a vaccine, probably says an awful lot.

It seems to be more about control than anything else.


Control of the virus, yes. Vaccinated communities can return to normal without risking nightmare scenes of mass burials and an overwhelmed medical system. Remember what it looked like during surges of the virus in hot spots? Remember how many health care workers died before they were vaccinated?

No one who is fully vaccinated via any of the vaccines approved in the US has died from virus and very few have been hospitalized. Some of the vaccines not approved in the US have a slightly less glowing record.

Where were these mass burials and overwhelmed hospitals?
Covid has a 99.6% survivability rate. Thats better odds than me surviving my commute home from work.
This entire ordeal has been about government over reach and acclimating the population to the idea of giving up their
freedom for "safety".


Either you haven't watched the news the past year or you've quickly forgotten. Freezer trucks with the dead in New York last March? Triaging care in Italy last February? Families unable to bury their dead just recently in India?

The broad range public policy goal has always been, from a totally cold perspective, about keeping the disease within the confines of what can be safely, comfortably and effectively handled by local medical systems.

Live in fear if that is your wish. I choose not to.



magz
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22 Jun 2021, 9:20 am

Kitty4670 wrote:
magz wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
vaccines dont "cure" anything. Vaccines prevent healthy folks from catching the disease. But they dont do anything for you if you already have the disease.

If you already have polio then shooting up with the famous Salk Polio Vaccines is not going to make your polio go away.

Vaccines just prevent you from contracting the disease in the first place.

So healthy tots today get the Salk vaccine, and it provokes their bodies to build up immunity so the tots dont contract the disease in the first place. Since no one gets polio now polio is under control now.

Some vaccines - like tenatus and rabies - can be administered after contact with the pathogen but before developing symptoms. It happens for diseases that take long time "preparing to attack", so the vaccine can work as an early alarm.

Covid vaccines are not this kind. They prevent healthy people from contracting covid, make symptoms a lot milder in "breakthrough" cases (disease contracted despite having been vaccinated) and they limit spreading of it.

So the vaccine is a cure.

The difference is:
A cure is used for ill people to heal.
A vaccine is used for healthy people not to get ill.


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kraftiekortie
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22 Jun 2021, 9:53 am

An antibiotic cures diseases.

A vaccine prevents diseases

Like Magz was saying.



funeralxempire
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22 Jun 2021, 10:01 am

Mr Reynholm wrote:
Live in fear if that is your wish. I choose not to.


No need to live in fear once you've got your Bill Gates 5G microchips installed. 8)


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Mr Reynholm
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22 Jun 2021, 11:45 am

funeralxempire wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
Live in fear if that is your wish. I choose not to.


No need to live in fear once you've got your Bill Gates 5G microchips installed. 8)

I prefer to skip the microchip as well. Nobody elected Bill Gates.



funeralxempire
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22 Jun 2021, 12:07 pm

Mr Reynholm wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
Live in fear if that is your wish. I choose not to.


No need to live in fear once you've got your Bill Gates 5G microchips installed. 8)

I prefer to skip the microchip as well. Nobody elected Bill Gates.


FWIW, I was parodying those folks, not agreeing with them. I don't actually have any paranoia towards the vaccine and I'm looking forward to getting my second shot soon. I've chosen to not live in fear.


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lostproperty
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22 Jun 2021, 12:19 pm

Not everybody who gets vaccinated will be protected. A percentage of people who have had both jabs have been shown to have no immunity (I heard an NHS doctor give a figure of 10%-20% on a podcast I listened to last week). It's a complicated process that works in stages, rather like a moon mission where the rocket separates bit by bit, everything has to work perfectly otherwise the mission fails (no protection) or you get varying degrees of side effects (from mild to severe in the short term, unknown long term).