How have NTs survived with their smiles covered behind masks

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ResilientBrilliance
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13 Oct 2021, 2:23 pm

cyberdad wrote:
ResilientBrilliance wrote:
It's no secret to NTs that smiles can be fake. It's interesting they still place so much importance on smiling.


Again this is cultural/situational and individual. If you become familiar with a person smiling you learn to identify the subtle nuances that dictate whether the smile is genuine or whether there is an ulterior motive,

Kind of a composite measure through gauging the full body/facial reaction which can also include the tone of voice.

Yes I'm technically speaking about my experience as an American woman. But many, many NTs online have shared their experiences of being told to smile by complete strangers, not all of them female or American. And Walmart and McDonald's (American companies, to be fair) had smilies and "love to see you smile" as key aspects of their marketing. I definitely think smiling in most of America is a big deal. I even feel the need to fake smile at cashiers when I go to stores and restaurants. But you mention body language, and I don't understand body language (besides facial expressions) at all. I consciously try to make up for my "off" body language by fake smiling.



ResilientBrilliance
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13 Oct 2021, 2:26 pm

Joe90 wrote:
Quote:
Wearing face masks is one of the essential means to prevent the transmission of certain respiratory diseases such as coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19). Although acceptance of such masks is increasing in the Western hemisphere, many people feel that social interaction is affected by wearing a mask. In the present experiment, we tested the impact of face masks on the readability of emotions. The participants (N = 41, calculated by an a priori power test; random sample; healthy persons of different ages, 18–87 years) assessed the emotional expressions displayed by 12 different faces. Each face was randomly presented with six different expressions (angry, disgusted, fearful, happy, neutral, and sad) while being fully visible or partly covered by a face mask. Lower accuracy and lower confidence in one’s own assessment of the displayed emotions indicate that emotional reading was strongly irritated by the presence of a mask. We further detected specific confusion patterns, mostly pronounced in the case of misinterpreting disgusted faces as being angry plus assessing many other emotions (e.g., happy, sad, and angry) as neutral. We discuss compensatory actions that can keep social interaction effective (e.g., body language, gesture, and verbal communication), even when relevant visual information is crucially reduced.

You're referencing this article, correct?: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7545827/
The abstract says the authors give tips on body language. I will be reading this. Thanks for sharing.



cyberdad
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13 Oct 2021, 6:26 pm

ResilientBrilliance wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
ResilientBrilliance wrote:
It's no secret to NTs that smiles can be fake. It's interesting they still place so much importance on smiling.


Again this is cultural/situational and individual. If you become familiar with a person smiling you learn to identify the subtle nuances that dictate whether the smile is genuine or whether there is an ulterior motive,

Kind of a composite measure through gauging the full body/facial reaction which can also include the tone of voice.

Yes I'm technically speaking about my experience as an American woman. But many, many NTs online have shared their experiences of being told to smile by complete strangers, not all of them female or American. And Walmart and McDonald's (American companies, to be fair) had smilies and "love to see you smile" as key aspects of their marketing. I definitely think smiling in most of America is a big deal. I even feel the need to fake smile at cashiers when I go to stores and restaurants. But you mention body language, and I don't understand body language (besides facial expressions) at all. I consciously try to make up for my "off" body language by fake smiling.


I factor this might be an NT assumption but we "organically" pick up cues that aren't just the cursory "upside down frown" to detect a person's mood/disposition. Body language gives further data on reading a person's overall state of mind and whether they are inviting us to engage further etc. Remember a smile isn't an invitation. I've had plenty of NT women smile at me in public places (more so when I was younger and better looking) but I knew automatically the difference between nice day, I'm happy and I want to share my pleasant feelings with "Hi there!" engage with me".



1986
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14 Oct 2021, 12:32 am

The Japanese smile when they're angry, and laugh when they're nervous. Seems quite cultural to me.

I don't remember people smiling much at me in London. Those sods.



cyberdad
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14 Oct 2021, 3:10 am

1986 wrote:
I don't remember people smiling much at me in London. Those sods.


London or any large city people generally don't smile.



ResilientBrilliance
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14 Oct 2021, 6:29 pm

cyberdad wrote:
ResilientBrilliance wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
ResilientBrilliance wrote:
It's no secret to NTs that smiles can be fake. It's interesting they still place so much importance on smiling.


Again this is cultural/situational and individual. If you become familiar with a person smiling you learn to identify the subtle nuances that dictate whether the smile is genuine or whether there is an ulterior motive,

Kind of a composite measure through gauging the full body/facial reaction which can also include the tone of voice.

Yes I'm technically speaking about my experience as an American woman. But many, many NTs online have shared their experiences of being told to smile by complete strangers, not all of them female or American. And Walmart and McDonald's (American companies, to be fair) had smilies and "love to see you smile" as key aspects of their marketing. I definitely think smiling in most of America is a big deal. I even feel the need to fake smile at cashiers when I go to stores and restaurants. But you mention body language, and I don't understand body language (besides facial expressions) at all. I consciously try to make up for my "off" body language by fake smiling.


I factor this might be an NT assumption but we "organically" pick up cues that aren't just the cursory "upside down frown" to detect a person's mood/disposition. Body language gives further data on reading a person's overall state of mind and whether they are inviting us to engage further etc. Remember a smile isn't an invitation. I've had plenty of NT women smile at me in public places (more so when I was younger and better looking) but I knew automatically the difference between nice day, I'm happy and I want to share my pleasant feelings with "Hi there!" engage with me".

So you're saying the mouth is just one part what a "happy" person looks like to you? Even with the mouth covered, someone can still look happy because of their eyes and body language? This is how NTs have survived with masks covering up smiles? This makes sense because I assume it would be really gloomy for them to not look around and see happy people. Can you elaborate on what a person looks like when they're "smiling" with their body? Is the man in the above pic smiling with his body?

I don't really get what you mean when you say women smiled at you when you were younger and better looking. Did women notice you more and then acknowledged you with a smile?

Do you expect random strangers to smile at you in such a way that says "Hi there engage with me?" That's an extrovert thing right? To be on the lookout for random strangers to approach and chitchat with?



ResilientBrilliance
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14 Oct 2021, 6:29 pm

1986 wrote:
The Japanese smile when they're angry, and laugh when they're nervous. Seems quite cultural to me.

I don't remember people smiling much at me in London. Those sods.

Here's a popular British Youtuber(idk if from London) saying he was at a bus stop (so not a small city) and a random man to told him "cheer up." Video is less than 4 minutes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WuFSXXJ3Zws

To be fair, the video is about resting b***h face which is not the same as absence of smiling. I'm probably wrong about smiling. Probably if a person looks normal they aren't required to smile and no one will say anything to them if they don't smile. But if they look "bitchy", sad, or just different, people will make comments to them. In my case, maybe I look strange because of my body language and that garners rude comments and stares.