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badRobot
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17 May 2021, 8:57 am

carlos55 wrote:
The clip shows what looks like a NT shouting, swearing self entitled teenager talking like she had been sent to a North Korean concentration camp.

Bad things may or may not have happened there but I’m sure they probably try to do there best and some of these kids may be violent and disturbed.

These type of shows exist in the UK like Jeremy Kyle for example for entertainment purposes. They exist in the grey area between entertainment and help though they raise awareness of issues which is a positive thing.

Though they only usually feature over 18s.

Its morally questionable though bringing a troubled kid on tv to be seen by millions when they deserve anonymity and specialized help.

Having said that the kid in the clip should self reflect on her behavior and her relationship with her parents. What may have led them to go on the show in the first place.

It’s probably a generational thing.


Her look and how she speaks is part of subculture she belongs to. She just as easily could be a goth or death metal fan, wear corpse paint or have satanic tattoos on her forehead, whatever. It doesn't mean something is wrong with her, it doesn't mean you should not take her claims seriously. This is part of the problem: people responsible for her wellbeing, including her parents, didn't believe her.

I don't like this subculture, but it doesn't matter. What she has to say about situations in these facilities is important and must be investigated properly.

A lot of people on the spectrum face similar issues on daily basis.



The_Znof
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17 May 2021, 9:04 am

carlos55 wrote:


The clip shows what looks like a NT shouting, swearing self entitled teenager talking like she had been sent to a North Korean concentration camp.

.


It’s more like an American camp in iraq or guantonimo bay, Or something from Donald ewen Cameron, and it is great when she called dr Phil’s audience “h0S” back in the day cuz they are the worst of hos



badRobot
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17 May 2021, 9:11 am

The_Znof wrote:
carlos55 wrote:


The clip shows what looks like a NT shouting, swearing self entitled teenager talking like she had been sent to a North Korean concentration camp.

.


It’s more like an American camp in iraq or guantonimo bay, Or something from Donald ewen Cameron, and it is great when she called dr Phil’s audience “h0S” back in the day cuz they are the worst of hos


And she says she was instructed to act this way to make a good show and considering anything I know about behind the scenes of reality shows, I'm inclined to believe her.



carlos55
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17 May 2021, 9:20 am

If someone wants a serious diagnosis of a mental health issue don’t do it via a tv show.

If bad things happened they need investigating but no need to ruin things for the other kids with non mental health behavior issues who may benefit.

There’s boxing gyms in the US run by cops for low income kids, why close something like that down because some cop misbehaved for example.



badRobot
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17 May 2021, 10:51 am

carlos55 wrote:
If someone wants a serious diagnosis of a mental health issue don’t do it via a tv show.

If bad things happened they need investigating but no need to ruin things for the other kids with non mental health behavior issues who may benefit.

There’s boxing gyms in the US run by cops for low income kids, why close something like that down because some cop misbehaved for example.


Yes, generalization is not good. But this is not generalization, making example from one case, such shows are fundamentally bad by design. These shows are created for profit, profit depends on ratings, ratings depend an all kinds of factors, but wellbeing of involved people is just not one of them.

Quote:
These type of shows exist in the UK like Jeremy Kyle for example for entertainment purposes. They exist in the grey area between entertainment and help though they raise awareness of issues which is a positive thing.


Again, shows are created for ratings, so by design they are inclined to spread myths and misconceptions that are good for drama, but mostly damaging for wellbeing. Less awareness is better than commonly accepted misbeliefs and fallacies.



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17 May 2021, 1:58 pm

The_Znof wrote:
Thank you for the interest Mona.

Sadly I don’t think improvements are likely and these places are fine tuned Hellholes which are watched over closely by thier creators, not only to learn how to make the camps even worse and interfere in real time, but also for entertainment.

Also the mean and stupid people they hire for guards seem to be getting worse fast.

Paris Hilton made a doc on these camps, and I suspect that may have been the tipping point for the camps and dr Phil.

Ps I didn’t get back to put the vid in my Bailey post last night. I do recommend this vid. It’s sad but also touching.





I remember that episode and I thought the girl on the show was a narcissist but to be fair, those suffering from NPD also have trauma and it's a shame how they are stigmatized that even they can't get proper support from therapists. Instead they are seen as manipulative and attention seekers so the therapist wants nothing to do with them.

It's interesting how someone can see this in a different perspective. I only see it from a victim perspective and the general perspective on narcissism.


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17 May 2021, 2:02 pm

Carlos55 do some research before commenting. You're dismissing actual severe abuse as just kids not behaving.

Seriously mate. No.



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17 May 2021, 2:15 pm

badRobot wrote:
Dr. Phil is a TV-personality, showman, pundit and charlatan. He should not be considered an authority in any matters related to mental health.

This is show business. They don't care about people's best interests by design.

There is a huge controversy developing about abuse in facilities he endorsed:



I love it how these kids go on the show and play the victim when they mistreat their parents and this girl even put a hole in the wall in her parents home with a hair brush and she was very disrespectful to Dr. Phil. Plus she kept talking in some slang and acted all cool on the show. Now she says she had trauma? Why do people use trauma as an excuse to be mean and bully others? Even Sarah Burleton has called it out in one of her articles saying how she sees people using it as an excuse rather than working on it to be better people and not abuse others.

Seriously, something I figured out in 6th grade is if you want to be a victim, be nice to people and respect them and you will get sympathy because once people see how badly you treat and bully others, they will see you are not some innocent victim and you won't get any support.


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hurtloam
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17 May 2021, 2:16 pm

D'Angelo Wallace did a video on this too.



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17 May 2021, 2:18 pm

League_Girl wrote:
badRobot wrote:
Dr. Phil is a TV-personality, showman, pundit and charlatan. He should not be considered an authority in any matters related to mental health.

This is show business. They don't care about people's best interests by design.

There is a huge controversy developing about abuse in facilities he endorsed:



I love it how these kids go on the show and play the victim when they mistreat their parents and this girl even put a hole in the wall in her parents home with a hair brush and she was very disrespectful to Dr. Phil. Plus she kept talking in some slang and acted all cool on the show. Now she says she had trauma? Why do people use trauma as an excuse to be mean and bully others? Even Sarah Burleton has called it out in one of her articles saying how she sees people using it as an excuse rather than working on it to be better people and not abuse others.

Seriously, something I figured out in 6th grade is if you want to be a victim, be nice to people and respect them and you will get sympathy because once people see how badly you treat and bully others, they will see you are not some innocent victim and you won't get any support.


That's exactly why abuse gets swept under the rug and why the murder of sex workers doesn't get investigated. People label the actual victims as bad and unbelievable or say they deserved what they got.



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17 May 2021, 2:23 pm

If someone is hurting you, how about you defend yourself against that person but once you take it out on others who have done nothing to you, you are not innocent. Look at bullies for example? Did you know some of the bullies are also victims of bullying? Where is the sympathy from the bullied for their bullies? If you try to express any sympathy for a bully, you will anger anyone who was a bullied victim and see you as a bully sympathizer.

This is no different. No one has the right to be abusive like no one has the right to shoot up a school because they were bullied.


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carlos55
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17 May 2021, 2:24 pm

hurtloam wrote:
Carlos55 do some research before commenting. You're dismissing actual severe abuse as just kids not behaving.

Seriously mate. No.


Was just commenting on the original clip since it was Autism related, i didnt think what was said on the show was a big deal.

I dont know DrPhil i live in the UK & never heard of him & dont know if he`s a good guy or not.

If there`s evidence of abuse let it be reported to the cops and then everyone can have their day in court, but it seems like trial by internet.



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17 May 2021, 2:31 pm

People wonder why there is a stigma against cluster B disorders, it's because people with it keep abusing others so it's hard to see them as victims when they are victimizing others. You are not a victim when you mistreat others and bully. You are only a victim of what you went through but not a victim of how you treat others around you who have done nothing to you.

If people with cluster B want to end the stigma, they can end it by not abusing others and call other people out with Cluster B issues that use it as an excuse to be mean to their loved ones and to their own kids. They can even call these people out that were on the show in their youtube videos like I have seen LGBT people do with other LGBT people.

There are people out there that deal with trauma that do not abuse others.


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badRobot
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17 May 2021, 2:38 pm

League_Girl wrote:
People wonder why there is a stigma against cluster B disorders, it's because people with it keep abusing others so it's hard to see them as victims when they are victimizing others. You are not a victim when you mistreat others and bully. You are only a victim of what you went through but not a victim of how you treat others around you who have done nothing to you.

If people with cluster B want to end the stigma, they can end it by not abusing others and call other people out with Cluster B issues that use it as an excuse to be mean to their loved ones and to their own kids. They can even call these people out that were on the show in their youtube videos like I have seen LGBT people do with other LGBT people.

There are people out there that deal with trauma that do not abuse others.


Newborn human is a blank slate. If some person was abused their whole life, this is the model of behavior they think is normal. It's not like they consciously make a choice to be as*holes or something. Why isn't it obvious?

If 13yr old mistreats her parents - it's 100% their fault.



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17 May 2021, 2:47 pm

badRobot wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
People wonder why there is a stigma against cluster B disorders, it's because people with it keep abusing others so it's hard to see them as victims when they are victimizing others. You are not a victim when you mistreat others and bully. You are only a victim of what you went through but not a victim of how you treat others around you who have done nothing to you.

If people with cluster B want to end the stigma, they can end it by not abusing others and call other people out with Cluster B issues that use it as an excuse to be mean to their loved ones and to their own kids. They can even call these people out that were on the show in their youtube videos like I have seen LGBT people do with other LGBT people.

There are people out there that deal with trauma that do not abuse others.


Newborn human is a blank slate. If some person was abused their whole life, this is the model of behavior they think is normal. It's not like they consciously make a choice to be as*holes or something. Why isn't it obvious?

If 13yr old mistreats her parents - it's 100% their fault.


So we should tolerate abuse from someone if they were abused their whole lives growing up?

You can accept such person in your life, I won't. I will pass on that person. It is up for them to help themselves and therapists are trained to deal with it. I am not a therapist and don't have to put up with it.


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Last edited by League_Girl on 17 May 2021, 2:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

League_Girl
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17 May 2021, 2:50 pm

I guess it was my mom's fault then I was abusing her even though she never abused me. But once she told me she would send me away to a mental hospital if I ever hurt her again or my brother, I stopped. I couldn't play the victim here and say my mom would abandon me. I was 16 so I knew.


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