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funeralxempire
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24 Sep 2021, 7:08 pm

Aspie1 wrote:
ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
A little over a thousand years ago, there was a shortage of both available farmland and women for wives in Scandinavia. What came of it? The rise of the VIKINGS; effectively a proto-biker gang on a mass scale that went around raping and pillaging. They had little else to live for...
That's true. But ironically, today, Sweden is a feminist utopia and anti-male dystopia, the one that puts the movie "Wicker Man" (google it) to shame.

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
You talk alpha/beta as if those are the two binary options. 0 or 1.

Truth is, it's a diamond shape structure. ALPHA minority on top. BETA (passable) majority as a gigantic middle. OMEGA on the bottom.
The Red Pill blogs I study don't recognize the omega concept. They say there's a rigid divide between 20% of alpha males and 80% of beta males. Feminists say that men are a combination of a sperm bank and an ATM. Well, the alpha males are sperm banks, and the beta males are ATM's. Which is true: women want to have sex with alphas and settle down for a stable life with betas. Heck, that the sexual strategy ducks, geese, and swans use. And we're not as different from our animal predecessors as we imagine ourselves to be, the Bible notwithstanding.


The guys who's opinions you read explain things in one oversimplified manner but it seems that even other people who view things in an oversimplified manner know reducing it to a binary notion is foolish. Overall the argument really comes down to which version of an incorrect meme is bought into.

I've succeeded in this regard in spite always being broke and not wanting kids, meaning I'm neither a sperm bank nor an ATM. I'm just quirky pervert who can sometimes be interesting and engaging.

There's other posters here who clearly succeed at establishing long-term, intimate romantic relationships on here. Not all of them are financially stable or otherwise able to fulfil what you claim a beta requires. If the rules are as you claim them to be many people consistently break them. Even if those norms are in play for some people the smart players of the game would simply learn to focus their attention on other people who play outside the rules since those will likely be the more compatible people.

A lot of people (including every feminist I've known) choose to pursue people they find interesting and enjoy the company of. In my experience being interesting and enjoyable to be around makes up for shortcomings elsewhere.


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ironpony
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24 Sep 2021, 10:01 pm

Well for the people on here who made a point about how there are married men who do not seem goodlooking at all, I too know a good amount of them. It was also said on here before that us guys cannot tell if they are goodlooking and that they are probably goodlooking to women in general.

However, as a guy I can still say that the married men are not model level goodlooking or leading man in a movie level goodlooking.

So even if it's true that you need to be goodlooking to get laid with women, you do not need to be leading man level goodlooking.



Aspie1
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24 Sep 2021, 10:16 pm

ironpony wrote:
However, as a guy I can still say that the married men are not model level goodlooking or leading man in a movie level goodlooking.

So even if it's true that you need to be goodlooking to get laid with women, you do not need to be leading man level goodlooking.
That's a Schrodinger's Truth: it's both true and false. It's not that man doesn't need to be model-looking to get a woman to marry him. It's that the men women sexually desire and the men women marry for stability/money are two different kinds: the alphas and the betas, respectively. (I don't recognize the concept of omega males.) Alpha males are desirable to women by the virtue of their genes. Beta males are not.

So when a woman marries a beta, she doesn't have any sexual feelings for him. Any sex that does happen within marriage is the reluctant, obligatory kind, like on his birthday. So the marriage ends up being mostly sexless and full of constant arguing, with the man leading a life of quiet misery, using work and/or alcohol as escape tools, while the woman enjoys a stable life and being able to say she has a husband. Not to mention a huge financial win when she divorces him, and gets the house, the car, the dog, his coin collection, the full custody of the kids, the ongoing alimony, the ongoing child support, and 50% of everything he owns.

Heck, I'd marry a beta schmuck if I were a woman. I'd get all that easy money for the price of very rare sex and a pregnancy. Plus thousands of dollars worth of free jewelry I'd get to keep, along with the sympathy of everybody and their brother.



cyberdad
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24 Sep 2021, 10:31 pm

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
A little over a thousand years ago, there was a shortage of both available farmland and women for wives in Scandinavia. What came of it? The rise of the VIKINGS; effectively a proto-biker gang on a mass scale that went around raping and pillaging. They had little else to live for...


I know a little bit about Scandanavian history and can say you are half right. There were climate/crop issues along with lack of good farmland to service a growing population. As most Scandanavians were actually farmers this was a driving factor in going "viking" (or literally stealing lands, raping pillaging). But I'll let you to a little secret. This was "the way" for all pre-christian Indo-European peoples. Rite of passage for young men was to leave the village and seek out new lands. This is infact how the first Roman armies started.

Christianity influenced the creation of formal nation states and for the first time After Rome you had standing armies. The Vikings were literally the last pagans left in Europe so were painted as some type of vile "evil" by christian Anglo-Saxons but infact the Anglo-Saxons did exactly the same thing in raping and pillaging the celts of Britain. Infact there is evidence the Beaker people from northwest Germany did this to the paleolithic Britians thousands of years ago, then the cults did this to the beaker people and then finally the Anglo-Saxons did it to the celts.

But...none of this has anything to do with women.



Last edited by cyberdad on 24 Sep 2021, 10:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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24 Sep 2021, 10:39 pm

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
Psychological issues are actually meaningless, at least in the short-term. Really, really mentally messed up people can still get a foot-in-the-door if their face is aesthetically pleasing. As for your ex, he was obviously of average quality looks if you and another women were interested. Overcoming his acne may even put him in a statistically good-looking category for all I know (not sure what he looked like).

But that's not what I asked you. Didn't ask about your ex's, I asked about men you've rejected.


I think you missed Mag'z underlying point. Women find self-confidence attractive. This is an extra weapon in your arsenal. You can't change how you physically look, but you can give it a good fight. Spend your money on self-care, grooming, clothes, a nice car and change your philosophy on life. Take the philosophy if a girl rejects you even when you put you best foot forward then its her loss and move on to the next girl.

I think its better to have tried than not tried at all. Then when you get to my age you can rant and rave on forums like this one. You should be using your free time to make money, buy expensive clothes/grooming kits and work on building a positive self-attitude. Go out there and be a hunter.



ironpony
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24 Sep 2021, 10:49 pm

Aspie1 wrote:
ironpony wrote:
However, as a guy I can still say that the married men are not model level goodlooking or leading man in a movie level goodlooking.

So even if it's true that you need to be goodlooking to get laid with women, you do not need to be leading man level goodlooking.
That's a Schrodinger's Truth: it's both true and false. It's not that man doesn't need to be model-looking to get a woman to marry him. It's that the men women sexually desire and the men women marry for stability/money are two different kinds: the alphas and the betas, respectively. (I don't recognize the concept of omega males.) Alpha males are desirable to women by the virtue of their genes. Beta males are not.

So when a woman marries a beta, she doesn't have any sexual feelings for him. Any sex that does happen within marriage is the reluctant, obligatory kind, like on his birthday. So the marriage ends up being mostly sexless and full of constant arguing, with the man leading a life of quiet misery, using work and/or alcohol as escape tools, while the woman enjoys a stable life and being able to say she has a husband. Not to mention a huge financial win when she divorces him, and gets the house, the car, the dog, his coin collection, the full custody of the kids, the ongoing alimony, the ongoing child support, and 50% of everything he owns.

Heck, I'd marry a beta schmuck if I were a woman. I'd get all that easy money for the price of very rare sex and a pregnancy. Plus thousands of dollars worth of free jewelry I'd get to keep, along with the sympathy of everybody and their brother.


But I thought it was personality that determines if the guy is a beta, not looks.

But also, if women are willing to settle for beta males for money and stability, rather than because of their looks, then why don't incel men go for these women then? They don't have to marry them but date them and have sex with them for experience, if women go for non-goodlooking guys for stability and money?



Aspie1
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24 Sep 2021, 10:55 pm

cyberdad wrote:
I think its better to have tried than not tried at all. Then when you get to my age you can rant and rave on forums like this one. You should be using your free time to make money, buy expensive clothes/grooming kits and work on building a positive self-attitude. Go out there and be a hunter.
I think this is a stretch, but I'll bite. So explain two of my situations.

September 2019, not too long before the Biden scamdemic. I did a cruise, and sang karaoke like a badas the first night. A woman saw it, and called me over to sit with her. I ended up hanging out with her, her friends, and a few new people she met. They all thought I was awesome, including one man who briefly challenged me with mildly annoying joke.

May of 2020, when I joined QAnon. I went to their party. During a conversation with a few people at the party, I angrily trashed Biden, George Soros, Anthony Fauci, and every Democrat politician I could think of. One woman heard me, and loved it. I ended up French kissing her and then some, thus giving social distancing the middle finger.

During the first scenario, I wore my basic vacation clothes. During the second scenario, I wore a custom-made anti-CDC T-shirt I custom-ordered online. Neither of which was expensive in the slightest.



Last edited by Aspie1 on 24 Sep 2021, 11:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

cyberdad
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24 Sep 2021, 11:02 pm

Aspie1 wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
I think its better to have tried than not tried at all. Then when you get to my age you can rant and rave on forums like this one. You should be using your free time to make money, buy expensive clothes/grooming kits and work on building a positive self-attitude. Go out there and be a hunter.
I think this is a stretch, but I'll bite. So explain two of my situations.

September 2019, not too long before the Biden scamdemic. I did a cruise, and sang karaoke like a badass. A woman saw it, and called me over to sit with her. I ended up hanging out with her, her friends, and a few new people she met. They all thought I was awesome, including one man who briefly challenged me with mildly annoying joke.

May of 2020, when I joined QAnon. I went to their party. During a conversation with a few people at the party, I angrily trashed Biden, George Soros, Anthony Fauci, and every Democrat politician I could think of. One woman heard me, and loved it. I ended up French kissing her and then some, thus giving social distancing the middle finger.

During the first scenario, I wore my basic vacation clothes. During the second scenario, I wore a custom-made anti-CDC T-shirt I ordered online. Neither of which was expensive in the slightest.


Well you hardly sound like you are struggling :lol:

Have you heard of package deals. Car salesmen use them to make a sale. He offers a nice showroom car with all the modcons but then he throws in a paint job, tinting, GPS, reverse camera etc etc - advertises the deal and he what happens? he gets more people coming into the showroom.

Imagine you had that little bit extra? expensive mens after shave, expensive clothes, a nice car, you would be getting more than one french kiss and more than one offer.



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25 Sep 2021, 4:34 am

cyberdad wrote:
Imagine you had that little bit extra? expensive mens after shave, expensive clothes, a nice car, you would be getting more than one french kiss and more than one offer.

Agreed. As looks go down, compensatory factors come into play. But at some point, some men fall below compensatory level.

But if a man is at least passable looks-wise, then the more money and possessions he has can help aid his appeal to women. That's why I find this thread odd. So many people knock the looks theory, then seem to reiterate it...like the guy who suggested Eliot Rodger should have showed off his cash and fancy car in poorer neighborhoods to attract women with less money.

Ironically, the guys who say these things are themselves somewhat misogynistic, and oblivious to their own hypocrisy.



Last edited by ezbzbfcg2 on 25 Sep 2021, 4:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

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25 Sep 2021, 4:36 am

Aspie1 wrote:
Feminists say that men are a combination of a sperm bank and an ATM. Well, the alpha males are sperm banks, and the beta males are ATM's.

So, you're saying that any man can become an ATM if he works hard enough?

What's your situation? Did you age into sperm bank material, or did you work to become an ATM?



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25 Sep 2021, 4:38 am

I know a number of feminists and none of them ever claimed anything like that...


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25 Sep 2021, 4:42 am

cyberdad wrote:
But...none of this has anything to do with women.

If you study HISstory, it's always about women...Helen of Troy. Why do you think raping/pillaging, taking foreign brides is so commonplace in any conquest? You and I may both have distant/ancient Mongolian blood we're unaware of because of this phenomenon...



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25 Sep 2021, 4:49 am

magz wrote:
I know a number of feminists and none of them ever claimed anything like that...


Well what aspie1 is talking about is crazy fringe feminists who portray much more extreme ideas than most feminists. Unfortunately they do have a presence on the internet and make the rest of feminists look bad. Idk seems a lot of people don't get there are different sorts of feminism...I even if I get crap for it would say I lean more in the sex positive feminism idea where it's like 'hey leave as alone on how we use our bodies.' part of feminism in my view is women should be whatever kind of woman they want to be. We should not be shamed for dressing slu*ty or for being dressed too conservatively it should be our choice how we want to present ourselves.

But of course sex positive feminism is certainly at odds with that fringe feminism you describe, like some of those think women have like litterally no consent with sex ever, like convinced that we all do it out of need to please a partner rather than even considering maybe some of us women like to enjoy sex with our partner. But that stuff is not mainstream feminism its fringe stuff like the stuff you find on r/female dating strategywhich most people say is a toxic subreddit.


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25 Sep 2021, 5:11 am

In regards to women who like men all wanting to go for 'Alpha' types and that any woman who goes for a Beta is doing so out of pity. I - don't follow that logic. Makes me wonder what you think of relationships that fall outside of this dynamic. Such as when you have a woman and man who are both fairly feminine, but are dating each other. I knew a couple like that, and considering how much third-wheeling I was doing whilst they'd make out, I doubt it was out of pity. Women aren't a hive mind, preferences exist. She didn't end up with him, but the guy she ended up with was also fairly feminine.

Besides, there is more to a relationship than just sex. Trust and communication are also important. Some people don't care for sex at all. The example of a marriage where a woman has sex with her husband out of pity or as a treat and gets pregnant out of obligation...there's a lot to unpack there. First, it presents sex as something she provides, but it takes two to tango. Both parties should be getting something out of the experience and neither of them owe each other sex, if either believes they do then that's rather sad. I doubt that most heterosexual marriages (since that's what we seem to be talking about in this thread) are 'Eh, he'll do I guess' situations.


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25 Sep 2021, 8:03 am

cyberdad wrote:
Well you hardly sound like you are struggling :lol:
...
Imagine you had that little bit extra? expensive mens after shave, expensive clothes, a nice car, you would be getting more than one french kiss and more than one offer.
Maybe not, but it took me 10 years to go from subhuman, disgusting-looking garbage to passably attractive.

I can see the "package" concept, but the return isn't worth the investment. Many a time, I've gotten attention from women without splurging financially. Like the QAnon party, where the only special thing I wore was that T-shirt mocking the CDC. And its intent was politics, rather than showing wealth. The woman who kissed me was far from model-looking, and was at least in mid 40's. But that was an unusual situation. We were mentally worn out from the social isolation and desperate for human contact, and took it out on each other. ;) If more college women were conservative and the Flu-19 scamdemic existed back then, perhaps even my 18-year-old self would've French kissed a woman at a party like that. Maybe even a 40-something woman. 8O

The cruise, on the other hand was an "achievement", with the "extras" being the cruise itself. The woman who liked me was someone who'd have chewed me up and spit me out if she met me during college. (She was 36, like me.) She had sleeve tattoos, dropped F-bombs, and acted tough. But in 2019, she liked my unapologetic, no-holds-barred persona.

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
So, you're saying that any man can become an ATM if he works hard enough?

What's your situation? Did you age into sperm bank material, or did you work to become an ATM?
Yes, for the most part. The looks threshold goes down the richer a man gets. But you also can't forget whether or not the woman enjoying your money actually respects you.

Neither. I will never be a sperm bank, because I'm biologically beta. I can emulate an alpha male, but I can't pass for one with all women. And I refuse to act as a woman's ATM. Come to think of it, women who were truly into me often bought me things, like a drink or a lunch.



Last edited by Aspie1 on 25 Sep 2021, 8:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

Axeman
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25 Sep 2021, 8:08 am

Aspie1 wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
I think its better to have tried than not tried at all. Then when you get to my age you can rant and rave on forums like this one. You should be using your free time to make money, buy expensive clothes/grooming kits and work on building a positive self-attitude. Go out there and be a hunter.
I think this is a stretch, but I'll bite. So explain two of my situations.

September 2019, not too long before the Biden scamdemic. I did a cruise, and sang karaoke like a badas the first night. A woman saw it, and called me over to sit with her. I ended up hanging out with her, her friends, and a few new people she met. They all thought I was awesome, including one man who briefly challenged me with mildly annoying joke.

May of 2020, when I joined QAnon. I went to their party. During a conversation with a few people at the party, I angrily trashed Biden, George Soros, Anthony Fauci, and every Democrat politician I could think of. One woman heard me, and loved it. I ended up French kissing her and then some, thus giving social distancing the middle finger.

During the first scenario, I wore my basic vacation clothes. During the second scenario, I wore a custom-made anti-CDC T-shirt I custom-ordered online. Neither of which was expensive in the slightest.


I thought Biden was going to be arrested on national TV according to Q nut jobs. How did that work for you? Btw covid isn't a hoax.