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IstominFan
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30 Jul 2019, 10:14 am

I fear rejection because of a very specific issue I won't discuss here because of privacy issues. I fear a man wouldn't understand the issue and would reject me (or else treat me as if I were disabled) because of it.



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31 Jul 2019, 1:29 am

Rexi wrote:
Why would someone pretend to just like something to impress a girl they want a serious relationship with? Isnt she supposed to be smart enough and seek sincerity?
Guys often pretend or fake to impress girls in those teen movies & the girl falls for him. Something happens that causes the guy to get found out & the girl is upset at 1st but stays with him(or breaks up & then gets back together) cuz she fell for other characteristics in him that he wasn't faking & she's impressed by the effort he put into being with her.


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breaks0
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31 Jul 2019, 1:35 am

Rexi wrote:
Mystery can be attractive, too much is frustrating, though.

Flirting and playing with language funnily is really pleasant if it's subtle enough and it needs to be at a time she is ready for such. Tease, not giving an answer seriously sometimes.

Setting a time to tell her about your quirks in a fascinating way or opinion on some subject/have a fun discussion, makes her look forward to getting to know more.

Don't compliment her, but be nice. Don't touch, let her come to you. Play hard to get a little maybe at first.

Tell her what you dislike if she does something you're not into, but not excessively.

Don't use emotes, don't baby-talk. Don't bend, stay straight like an invincible bull, but don't huff and puff if you don't get your way. Show that you're not easily distressed as best you can.

[Fnord's suggestions are nice, I wish there was a guide for guys too]

What exactly is wrong or ineffective with compliments? I know I'm not speaking from a perspective of any success in dating, but I compliment those women who are in my life often and they usually appreciate it and sometimes find it flattering. I'm not saying overdo it with superlatives every time you see her, thats probably creepy. And it depends what you compliment her about and how you do it obviously. And maybe I'm both too old school in trying to be nice or even sweet as well as wearing my heart on my sleeve which I do. I just dont see why complimenting in moderation is a bad thing. Im not down with this whole hide your feelings all the time or play it so cool youre totally aloof. I dont wanna play games or do hookups even though dating is a game I know. All I'm trying to say is be real. Some women still appreciate it and it can help you make friends and if you keep at it find a partner too.



Rexi
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31 Jul 2019, 2:57 pm

Kurgan wrote:
Rexi wrote:
Kurgan wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Kurgan wrote:
... It's much easier to land a good job if you get a master's degree in engineering than if you get a useless degree in philosophy. You might also want to consider learning a trade.
Learning an artistic talent in addition to a skill or trade is also a plus. If you can entertain people with music (instrument preferred to voice), then they will want to hang around you. Drawing and painting are also good, and if you can bake and cook well enough, people will invite themselves for lunch -- not always, but it happens to me.


Learning to play the guitar helps. :) Much more than bulking up in the gym, but it's too late for me.

Guitars are gay. Why would someone pretend to just like something to impress a girl they want a serious relationship with? Isnt she supposed to be smart enough and seek sincerity?

why not a sax like Uncle J



The saxophone either sounds amazing (after years and years of practice) or it sounds awful -- and never anything in-between. :) Nobody is a mediocre sax player, but plenty of mediocre guitarists still manage to play music that's nice to listen to.

Then he's not all that special, even when he fakes it.



Rexi
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31 Jul 2019, 3:34 pm

breaks0 wrote:
Rexi wrote:
Mystery can be attractive, too much is frustrating, though.

Flirting and playing with language funnily is really pleasant if it's subtle enough and it needs to be at a time she is ready for such. Tease, not giving an answer seriously sometimes.

Setting a time to tell her about your quirks in a fascinating way or opinion on some subject/have a fun discussion, makes her look forward to getting to know more.

Don't compliment her, but be nice. Don't touch, let her come to you. Play hard to get a little maybe at first.

Tell her what you dislike if she does something you're not into, but not excessively.

Don't use emotes, don't baby-talk. Don't bend, stay straight like an invincible bull, but don't huff and puff if you don't get your way. Show that you're not easily distressed as best you can.

[Fnord's suggestions are nice, I wish there was a guide for guys too]

What exactly is wrong or ineffective with compliments? I know I'm not speaking from a perspective of any success in dating, but I compliment those women who are in my life often and they usually appreciate it and sometimes find it flattering. I'm not saying overdo it with superlatives every time you see her, thats probably creepy. And it depends what you compliment her about and how you do it obviously. And maybe I'm both too old school in trying to be nice or even sweet as well as wearing my heart on my sleeve which I do. I just dont see why complimenting in moderation is a bad thing. Im not down with this whole hide your feelings all the time or play it so cool youre totally aloof. I dont wanna play games or do hookups even though dating is a game I know. All I'm trying to say is be real. Some women still appreciate it and it can help you make friends and if you keep at it find a partner too.

My guess is the reason why I tend to like guys I can't impress is I set off on a chase and am hooked on them much easier trying to obtain their interest. "Hard to get" seems special, valuable, more appealing. Popularity is appealing to me, qualities of having held high position/skill in some group.

Theoretically it's best to have someone who is naturally attracted to what you have [my boyfriend is naturally cold and aloof, I'm basically describing everything that has gotten me really into him], if the attraction is just temporary, it may not be enough to form attachment. My boyfriend really doesn't seem weird at all in a repulsive way to me, maybe because everything i learned about him came at a very high cost and patience. But also we share a lot of views and he made me see a lot of things clearly, he's where my mind will reach eventually as a conclusion, but he does it faster. I would say we're very much alike in thinking.

You may be right that different women may like different kinds of men, I'm just one kind of woman. In fact I thought about that one morning after the day I wrote this and whether it's healthy or not for both people.

At one point I tried to form an attachment based on admiration instead of attractiveness [as they suggest women do for healthy choices], it went well for 5 months, she was my healthiest discussion and closeness, reliability-wise, but it failed. It seemed hard to enjoy myself and after a while i stopped trying to tell her what i wanted since she would do what I wanted in different ways and I wouldn't like it and didn't have the mindpower to correct her again. I grew frustrated at that exchange, pleasing her with all my energy and getting nothing out of it but i felt bad about her because of her past and i felt like I couldn't do anything.



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31 Jul 2019, 3:44 pm

nick007 wrote:
Rexi wrote:
Why would someone pretend to just like something to impress a girl they want a serious relationship with? Isnt she supposed to be smart enough and seek sincerity?
Guys often pretend or fake to impress girls in those teen movies & the girl falls for him. Something happens that causes the guy to get found out & the girl is upset at 1st but stays with him(or breaks up & then gets back together) cuz she fell for other characteristics in him that he wasn't faking & she's impressed by the effort he put into being with her.

autistics should be the last on Earth to need to fake interests, except well, if one's interest is deceased human bodies... @-@



breaks0
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31 Jul 2019, 7:14 pm

Rexi wrote:
breaks0 wrote:
Rexi wrote:
Mystery can be attractive, too much is frustrating, though.

Flirting and playing with language funnily is really pleasant if it's subtle enough and it needs to be at a time she is ready for such. Tease, not giving an answer seriously sometimes.

Setting a time to tell her about your quirks in a fascinating way or opinion on some subject/have a fun discussion, makes her look forward to getting to know more.

Don't compliment her, but be nice. Don't touch, let her come to you. Play hard to get a little maybe at first.

Tell her what you dislike if she does something you're not into, but not excessively.

Don't use emotes, don't baby-talk. Don't bend, stay straight like an invincible bull, but don't huff and puff if you don't get your way. Show that you're not easily distressed as best you can.

[Fnord's suggestions are nice, I wish there was a guide for guys too]

What exactly is wrong or ineffective with compliments? I know I'm not speaking from a perspective of any success in dating, but I compliment those women who are in my life often and they usually appreciate it and sometimes find it flattering. I'm not saying overdo it with superlatives every time you see her, thats probably creepy. And it depends what you compliment her about and how you do it obviously. And maybe I'm both too old school in trying to be nice or even sweet as well as wearing my heart on my sleeve which I do. I just dont see why complimenting in moderation is a bad thing. Im not down with this whole hide your feelings all the time or play it so cool youre totally aloof. I dont wanna play games or do hookups even though dating is a game I know. All I'm trying to say is be real. Some women still appreciate it and it can help you make friends and if you keep at it find a partner too.

My guess is the reason why I tend to like guys I can't impress is I set off on a chase and am hooked on them much easier trying to obtain their interest. "Hard to get" seems special, valuable, more appealing. Popularity is appealing to me, qualities of having held high position/skill in some group.

Theoretically it's best to have someone who is naturally attracted to what you have [my boyfriend is naturally cold and aloof, I'm basically describing everything that has gotten me really into him], if the attraction is just temporary, it may not be enough to form attachment. My boyfriend really doesn't seem weird at all in a repulsive way to me, maybe because everything i learned about him came at a very high cost and patience. But also we share a lot of views and he made me see a lot of things clearly, he's where my mind will reach eventually as a conclusion, but he does it faster. I would say we're very much alike in thinking.

You may be right that different women may like different kinds of men, I'm just one kind of woman. In fact I thought about that one morning after the day I wrote this and whether it's healthy or not for both people.

At one point I tried to form an attachment based on admiration instead of attractiveness [as they suggest women do for healthy choices], it went well for 5 months, she was my healthiest discussion and closeness, reliability-wise, but it failed. It seemed hard to enjoy myself and after a while i stopped trying to tell her what i wanted since she would do what I wanted in different ways and I wouldn't like it and didn't have the mindpower to correct her again. I grew frustrated at that exchange, pleasing her with all my energy and getting nothing out of it but i felt bad about her because of her past and i felt like I couldn't do anything.


In your last paragraph, you say "an attachment based on admiration instead of attractiveness". What do you mean or rather what's the difference/distinction between the two you have in mind? And not knowing your gender, I dunno if you're hetero or something "Queer", so was this thing w/the girl more of a friendship or a romantic relationship? I'm therefore not clear what this has to do w/compliments, though of course I'm not advocating any kind of one-sided relationship, platonic or otherwise. That's obviously unhealthy, but still all too common.

You say in your current relationship, your bf kind of reaches conclusions you do before you reach them and also that you share alot of views/thinking patterns in common. Also you say you're into his aloofness and that you like chasing after a guy like that who you can't impress easily, that it makes him seem more valuable and appealing to you, also that he's popular/has status.

So I get all that, what you have in common w/your bf sounds healthy and I'm well aware of the rep that "women like a challenge of a guy who's difficult to get" and such. I mean cognitively I can see why that would be appealing to many women. I suppose it's the kind of game I'm just unwilling to play, though, because I can't mask my feelings really when I like someone and I'm not interested in making someone pursue me, I find the idea of that arrogant (at least in the abstract) and I have no interest in being or appearing as an arrogant guy any more than I do being or appearing sexist. If someone pursues me or is interested in me, great and I probably can and should learn to play it a bit more cool than I have in the past (basically don't be creepy or too needy) to try to make that happen in the future.

When you say this, however, I don't follow your meaning: "Theoretically it's best to have someone who is naturally attracted to what you have... if the attraction is just temporary, it may not be enough to form attachment." You mean on her side toward me or another guy? I'm not the kind of person for whom that happens, when I'm into a girl I stay into a girl w/a one track mind basically. Do you mean she might lose interest from getting regular compliments? I can see that if that's what you mean. I dunno, I know this is being completely idealistic but I just wish there wasn't all this psychological power game bs involved, it's not real romantic love, it's just Machiavellian games of the heart and I really don't wanna play those, ever. I know Millennials at least in the US stereotypically have developed this whole Hookup culture and everything goes through online dating and whatnot now b/c people only have time to meet that way b/c they're always working multiple crappy, precarious jobs most of the time. So old school romance of the kind I'm thinking of maybe doesn't exist any more or at least is very hard to find. I respect all that and tbh I may be setting myself up b/c I wanna date a Millennial, badly. I have political views in common w/that generation and Gen Z more than my own, let alone boomers and that's a HUGE thing for me. I just want something real w/someone who is real, not to play a stupid power game where people aren't concerned w/their partner's or potential partner's feelings. This may lead me to get hurt, but I have no interest in hurting someone else, especially a romantic partner.



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31 Jul 2019, 8:22 pm

About this whole business of people liking the challenge of a potential romantic partner who is hard to get:

Not everyone is into this. I was never into it.

I think it arises from what I think of as the mutual slave-market mentality. By this I mean the attitude that everyone exists on a single linear, totally-ordered scale of value, and that everyone wants the highest-value partner they can get on this scale. From this belief it follows that if someone is very interested in you, then you must be of higher value than they are, hence they must not be the highest-value person you can get. From this belief it also follows that if a person is not interested in you, then that person must be of higher value than you, hence worth trying to seduce; and the only way to seduce the person is to deceive them into believing you are of higher value than you actually are; hence the need to play hard-to-get.

Frankly this whole way of thinking just grosses me out.

My approach has always been to seek out the rare people who shared my unusual interests, and to seek friendship first.


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31 Jul 2019, 8:56 pm

bigbadbeast2020 wrote:
Is anybody on the spectrum successful at dating on the spectrum?

I've always avoided standard dating rituals, but I'm a person on the spectrum with a partner on the spectrum.


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31 Jul 2019, 11:54 pm

Nope I don’t make enough money and I’m ugly.


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01 Aug 2019, 1:48 am

bigbadbeast2020 wrote:
Is anybody on the spectrum successful at dating on the spectrum?

Yes. Me.


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01 Aug 2019, 10:48 am

Dating is completely out of question

Transgender, long term unemployed, autistic

Emotional attachment :twisted: hrrts :evil:


Rejection


Cost benefit analysis



Rexi
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01 Aug 2019, 8:32 pm

breaks0 wrote:
Rexi wrote:
breaks0 wrote:
Rexi wrote:
Mystery can be attractive, too much is frustrating, though.

Flirting and playing with language funnily is really pleasant if it's subtle enough and it needs to be at a time she is ready for such. Tease, not giving an answer seriously sometimes.

Setting a time to tell her about your quirks in a fascinating way or opinion on some subject/have a fun discussion, makes her look forward to getting to know more.

Don't compliment her, but be nice. Don't touch, let her come to you. Play hard to get a little maybe at first.

Tell her what you dislike if she does something you're not into, but not excessively.

Don't use emotes, don't baby-talk. Don't bend, stay straight like an invincible bull, but don't huff and puff if you don't get your way. Show that you're not easily distressed as best you can.

[Fnord's suggestions are nice, I wish there was a guide for guys too]

What exactly is wrong or ineffective with compliments? I know I'm not speaking from a perspective of any success in dating, but I compliment those women who are in my life often and they usually appreciate it and sometimes find it flattering. I'm not saying overdo it with superlatives every time you see her, thats probably creepy. And it depends what you compliment her about and how you do it obviously. And maybe I'm both too old school in trying to be nice or even sweet as well as wearing my heart on my sleeve which I do. I just dont see why complimenting in moderation is a bad thing. Im not down with this whole hide your feelings all the time or play it so cool youre totally aloof. I dont wanna play games or do hookups even though dating is a game I know. All I'm trying to say is be real. Some women still appreciate it and it can help you make friends and if you keep at it find a partner too.

My guess is the reason why I tend to like guys I can't impress is I set off on a chase and am hooked on them much easier trying to obtain their interest. "Hard to get" seems special, valuable, more appealing. Popularity is appealing to me, qualities of having held high position/skill in some group.

Theoretically it's best to have someone who is naturally attracted to what you have [my boyfriend is naturally cold and aloof, I'm basically describing everything that has gotten me really into him], if the attraction is just temporary, it may not be enough to form attachment. My boyfriend really doesn't seem weird at all in a repulsive way to me, maybe because everything i learned about him came at a very high cost and patience. But also we share a lot of views and he made me see a lot of things clearly, he's where my mind will reach eventually as a conclusion, but he does it faster. I would say we're very much alike in thinking.

You may be right that different women may like different kinds of men, I'm just one kind of woman. In fact I thought about that one morning after the day I wrote this and whether it's healthy or not for both people.

At one point I tried to form an attachment based on admiration instead of attractiveness [as they suggest women do for healthy choices], it went well for 5 months, she was my healthiest discussion and closeness, reliability-wise, but it failed. It seemed hard to enjoy myself and after a while i stopped trying to tell her what i wanted since she would do what I wanted in different ways and I wouldn't like it and didn't have the mindpower to correct her again. I grew frustrated at that exchange, pleasing her with all my energy and getting nothing out of it but i felt bad about her because of her past and i felt like I couldn't do anything.


In your last paragraph, you say "an attachment based on admiration instead of attractiveness". What do you mean or rather what's the difference/distinction between the two you have in mind? And not knowing your gender, I dunno if you're hetero or something "Queer", so was this thing w/the girl more of a friendship or a romantic relationship? I'm therefore not clear what this has to do w/compliments, though of course I'm not advocating any kind of one-sided relationship, platonic or otherwise. That's obviously unhealthy, but still all too common.

You say in your current relationship, your bf kind of reaches conclusions you do before you reach them and also that you share alot of views/thinking patterns in common. Also you say you're into his aloofness and that you like chasing after a guy like that who you can't impress easily, that it makes him seem more valuable and appealing to you, also that he's popular/has status.

So I get all that, what you have in common w/your bf sounds healthy and I'm well aware of the rep that "women like a challenge of a guy who's difficult to get" and such. I mean cognitively I can see why that would be appealing to many women. I suppose it's the kind of game I'm just unwilling to play, though, because I can't mask my feelings really when I like someone and I'm not interested in making someone pursue me, I find the idea of that arrogant (at least in the abstract) and I have no interest in being or appearing as an arrogant guy any more than I do being or appearing sexist. If someone pursues me or is interested in me, great and I probably can and should learn to play it a bit more cool than I have in the past (basically don't be creepy or too needy) to try to make that happen in the future.

When you say this, however, I don't follow your meaning: "Theoretically it's best to have someone who is naturally attracted to what you have... if the attraction is just temporary, it may not be enough to form attachment." You mean on her side toward me or another guy? I'm not the kind of person for whom that happens, when I'm into a girl I stay into a girl w/a one track mind basically. Do you mean she might lose interest from getting regular compliments? I can see that if that's what you mean. I dunno, I know this is being completely idealistic but I just wish there wasn't all this psychological power game bs involved, it's not real romantic love, it's just Machiavellian games of the heart and I really don't wanna play those, ever. I know Millennials at least in the US stereotypically have developed this whole Hookup culture and everything goes through online dating and whatnot now b/c people only have time to meet that way b/c they're always working multiple crappy, precarious jobs most of the time. So old school romance of the kind I'm thinking of maybe doesn't exist any more or at least is very hard to find. I respect all that and tbh I may be setting myself up b/c I wanna date a Millennial, badly. I have political views in common w/that generation and Gen Z more than my own, let alone boomers and that's a HUGE thing for me. I just want something real w/someone who is real, not to play a stupid power game where people aren't concerned w/their partner's or potential partner's feelings. This may lead me to get hurt, but I have no interest in hurting someone else, especially a romantic partner.

Pursuing someone who you're head over heels crushing for, really crazy about = based on attraction, not always a lucky/healthy choice but it's hard to fight against or for your crush to ruin it with their negatives. Everything just seems cute or pleasant or interesting so its a nice easier relationship [unless you gotta fight with the fact theyve let you down and youre still attracted a lot towards them which is frustrating]. That helps a lot to resist the hardships and have a long lasting interest. And a long lasting relationship can turn into love. Girls can sometimes choose men based on the negative behaviors the girl's father had expressed, so they automatically see men with the same weaknesses their fathers had as potential partners to have families with. This is not often a healthy choice.

Pursuing someone based on admiration is pursuing someone who possesses great qualities, who you look up to and who can help you grow, someone with good moral values. Choosing this person is a choice based on brain decision rather than chemistry. The two are different and may often be opposites. When you find someone whom you can explore a lot of things with and is more at your level, they don't seem as attractive. You may see them more as a friend, an old acquaintance. This is tough to turn into something more from my experience. It never worked out for me, even though I thought they may be more valuable boyfriends. I just wasn't attracted enough.

I dated the girl, we dated for 5 months. Thing is the girl would not mind making compliments, being accessible for me, so I guess I took her for granted. But I wasnt very attracted to her from the get-go, she was a choice based on admiration.

My boyfriend isn't good at compliments, it's probably as hard for him to make them as to shoot a puppy, despite him loving me. He is on the spectrum. I am attracted to being denied and refused even if it frustrates me if it's too much. Maybe it's a way to cope with it? I don't know. I had endured it a year and i would probably endure it more, and still like the guy very much. Perhaps a balance as you suggested is healthier.

I meant it's best to have a girl who is attracted to the real you and what you can naturally offer. I want to think me and my boyfriend aren't the only Adams' family couple which perfectly works out as they are. I used to think I will never be able to have some working relationship unless I don't like the person that much, like with my ex. My boyfriend is the miracle partner most people will never find in their lives. And I used to think he was the worst thing that happened to me until I was able to see who he really is.

I meant if you fake being cold and at a point drop the mask she may realize the man whom she fell in love with actually is not the same and leave before she gets attached to him. Or maybe find him repulsive once the mask is off. When I'm into a guy a whole lot, it doesnt change in an attraction way, but i might end up seeing hes a jerk logically, and eventually leave him.

Mind and heart games are depressing, I agree. They're awful but they may work sometimes. I dont know, some people wont change what they feel about you no matter what games you play though, thats for sure. And others will like you if you dont play games.

I had issues with actually wanting to do relationship stuff with my boyfriend [e.g. sex] when he started to show interest in me after like a year+. It caused me panic attacks. I was scared i wouldnt be able to enjoy mutuality which was what ive been wanting all that time, but i think i also had trust issues toward him by that time and was scared what he was trying to do and whether he really meant mutuality.



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01 Aug 2019, 8:51 pm

Mona Pereth wrote:
About this whole business of people liking the challenge of a potential romantic partner who is hard to get:

Not everyone is into this. I was never into it.

I think it arises from what I think of as the mutual slave-market mentality. By this I mean the attitude that everyone exists on a single linear, totally-ordered scale of value, and that everyone wants the highest-value partner they can get on this scale. From this belief it follows that if someone is very interested in you, then you must be of higher value than they are, hence they must not be the highest-value person you can get. From this belief it also follows that if a person is not interested in you, then that person must be of higher value than you, hence worth trying to seduce; and the only way to seduce the person is to deceive them into believing you are of higher value than you actually are; hence the need to play hard-to-get.

Frankly this whole way of thinking just grosses me out.

My approach has always been to seek out the rare people who shared my unusual interests, and to seek friendship first.

I see it in terms of power, a powerful man won't be intimidated by a girl, easily impressed, or wear his heart on the sleeve. My brain thinks they're hot. Well, this can lead to trouble because that kind of men are often narcissistic. But, lucky me, this time, he was just autistic.



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04 Aug 2019, 12:45 pm

But you didn't use to think your kink was gross before 8)

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