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cyberdad
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01 May 2021, 7:32 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
I don’t like fascists, either....but I don’t want a fascist dead, especially since a fascist might disavow fascism in the next minute..


The people Pepe are highlighting have not and will not kill anyone. The placards are an expression of anger that backward belief systems still bubble away in mainstream society and are given oxygen by leaders like Trump.



SabbraCadabra
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01 May 2021, 11:32 pm

slam_thunderhide wrote:
The liberal-leftists who still whine about him can’t seem to explain how their lives were any different under Trump’s presidency than they were under Obama’s or how they are now under Biden’s.

I'm not a "liberal-leftist", but I think all you have to do is look at the current COVID numbers to see how our lives have changed under each President. Deaths have gone down, infections have gone way down, vaccine rates have gone way, way, way up.

It's impossible to know how things would have been different if former guy hadn't trashed the pandemic task force and ignored warnings from the scientific community, but I feel like at least a few hundred-thousand lives could have been saved.

slam_thunderhide wrote:
Since antifa played a pivotal role in the George Floyd riots, I might have expected left and right alike to join in condemning them.

Well I guess I have to eat my words, because I did not know that Antifa was Umbrella Man this whole time.
Image
Says here that he has been identified as a member of the prison gang "Aryan Cowboys", which is definitely Antifa and not a group of white supremacists.

Boogaloo Bois? Also Antifa.


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cyberdad
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02 May 2021, 2:10 am

SabbraCadabra wrote:
I'm not a "liberal-leftist"


Wow, so many Americans hate being called liberals.



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02 May 2021, 5:22 am

No. They hate being called “leftists.”



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02 May 2021, 7:00 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
No. They hate being called “leftists.”


I prefer "leftist" to "liberal" because, in other places in the world, "liberal" is a right-wing term.


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02 May 2021, 10:03 am

cyberdad wrote:
SabbraCadabra wrote:
I'm not a "liberal-leftist"


Wow, so many Americans hate being called liberals.

Because after year's of conservatives using the term as a pejorative it became stigmatized to the point of being labeled that meant that you were likely to lose your election. So liberal candidates who could not fake being a moderate or conservative started calling themselves progressives. Now it is democratic socialists and woke identity politics types who use “liberal” as a pejorative.


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02 May 2021, 11:30 am

Pepe wrote:
Quote:
Wikipedia is not a reliable source for citations elsewhere on Wikipedia. Because it can be edited by anyone at any time, any information it contains at a particular time could be vandalism, a work in progress, or just plain wrong. Biographies of living persons, subjects that happen to be in the news, and politically or culturally contentious topics are especially vulnerable to these issues. Edits on Wikipedia that are in error are usually fixed after some time. However, because Wikipedia is a volunteer-run project, it cannot constantly monitor every contribution. There are many errors that remain unnoticed for hours, days, weeks, months, or even years. Therefore, Wikipedia should not be considered a definitive source in and of itself.
Duh well who knew, apart from everyone. :roll:
But that doesn't mean absolutely everything there is utter rubbish - in general it still manages to provide a huge range of accurate information.

In any case, what does this have to do with the quote I posted, referencing 1984?
Irrespective of the source and having read the book several times it seems to me to be a sensible summary - what do you, personally, think about it?
Clearly it doesn't fall within the areas I've highlighted above.


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cyberdad
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02 May 2021, 4:18 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
SabbraCadabra wrote:
I'm not a "liberal-leftist"


Wow, so many Americans hate being called liberals.

Because after year's of conservatives using the term as a pejorative it became stigmatized to the point of being labeled that meant that you were likely to lose your election. So liberal candidates who could not fake being a moderate or conservative started calling themselves progressives. Now it is democratic socialists and woke identity politics types who use “liberal” as a pejorative.


That makes sense



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02 May 2021, 6:01 pm

Quote:
But what I think we can see is that, with fascist totalitarianism utterly defeated in WWII, Orwell found himself one of the relatively few people prepared to agitate against the left-totalitarianism of our erstwhile ally, the Soviet Union.

https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-21337504

Quote:
Unlike many British socialists in the 1930s and 1940s, Orwell was not enamored of the Soviet Union and its policies, nor did he consider the Soviet Union a positive representation of the possibilities of socialist society. He could not turn a blind eye to the cruelties and hypocrisies of Soviet Communist Party, which had overturned the semifeudal system of the tsars only to replace it with the dictatorial reign of Joseph Stalin. Orwell became a sharp critic of both capitalism and communism, and is remembered chiefly as an advocate of freedom and a committed opponent of communist oppression. His two greatest anti-totalitarian novels—Animal Farm and 1984—form the basis of his reputation. Orwell died in 1950, only a year after completing 1984, which many consider his masterpiece.
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A dystopian novel, 1984 attacks the idea of totalitarian communism (a political system in which one ruling party plans and controls the collective social action of a state) by painting a terrifying picture of a world in which personal freedom is nonexistent. Animal Farm, written in 1945, deals with similar themes but in a shorter and somewhat simpler format. A “fairy story” in the style of Aesop’s fables, it uses animals on an English farm to tell the history of Soviet communism.

https://www.sparknotes.com/lit/animalfarm/context/


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02 May 2021, 10:40 pm

cyberdad wrote:
Wow, so many Americans hate being called liberals.

I don't hate being called a liberal, I just don't identify as one. People always assume that if you don't believe Q conspiracies, you must be a "radical lib who watches too much CNN".


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cyberdad
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03 May 2021, 2:01 am

SabbraCadabra wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Wow, so many Americans hate being called liberals.

I don't hate being called a liberal, I just don't identify as one. People always assume that if you don't believe Q conspiracies, you must be a "radical lib who watches too much CNN".


Well I don't identify myself as liberal or leftist either, but I do agree with more of what they say than those on the right of the political spectrum. You don't have to say "I'm not a liberal" to make a point, I'm happy to say I support leftists and liberals without wearing a BLM or Green-leftist or LGBTQI badge as that's not my identity.



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03 May 2021, 4:49 am

cyberdad wrote:
Well I don't identify myself as liberal or leftist either, but I do agree with more of what they say than those on the right of the political spectrum.

But we have more than two parties =)


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cyberdad
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03 May 2021, 5:13 am

SabbraCadabra wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Well I don't identify myself as liberal or leftist either, but I do agree with more of what they say than those on the right of the political spectrum.

But we have more than two parties =)


Only two matter in any one country