Male disposability, the Apex fallacy, and male privilege

Page 1 of 6 [ 83 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next

dorkseid
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 28 Jun 2020
Gender: Male
Posts: 825
Location: Tarkon Galtos

26 May 2021, 12:00 am

TRIGGER WARNING!! !!This post contains discussions about physical and sexual violence.




I would like to clarify that the purpose of this thread is in no way to deny any struggles women have or continue to experience. After all, I think we can all agree that anyone who would gaslight and deny the struggles of an entire class of people on the basis of their gender is a sh!tty human being. I simply want to shed some light on the oft overlooked struggles and adversity many men face.

With that out of the way, let's begin:

The very first thing I would like to talk about is the social phenomenon known as male disposability. Remember that scene in the Titanic, when women and children are called to board the lifeboats, while the men (with the exception of the wealthy ones like Cal) are ordered to stay behind and die? Remember how several men were gunned down for the crime of not wanting to die? This is actually a fairly common social phenomenon. While an elite minority of men control the wealth and power in a society, the lives of the powerless and impoverished majority of men are considered by society to have significantly less value than those of child-bearing women. Not only is this vast majority of men overworked and underpaid, never getting a foothold in the social hierarchy; but they are treated as literal canon fodder sent out to die on the front lines of wars their neither had any control in the creation of nor benefit from in any way. These foot soldiers are never valued by their generals as anything more than a strategic asset to be sacrificed without a second thought, and often act as human shields to protect their "more important" superior officers. And even in times of peace, the destitute majority of men are commonly relegated to dangerous jobs like mining or construction, that result in high numbers of work-related injuries and fatalities. And to add insult to injury, the men doing these jobs are working for chicken scratch and struggle their whole lives from pay check to pay check. This culling of men is evolutionarily desirable, as it weeds the "unfit" males from the gene pool. It is also desirable by the upper echelon of men who hold power, as it serves to curtail the threat of potential competitors rising to challenge them.

The Apex Fallacy is a logical fallacy in which a group is evaluated according to the performance of only its best/strongest members. An example would be the statement that all basketball players are as skilled as Michael Jordan or Lebron James. Which is, of course, equally as absurd as arguing that because all cows are mammals, all mammals therefore must be cows. In relation to the male privilege argument, woke culture looks at who possesses the wealth and power in our society and sees that its mostly men, then concludes from that that all men are privileged. When the reality is that most of what it commonly described as male privilege is limited to the very small percentage of men at the top.

Now, let's look at some of the facts that woke culture doesn't want you to know about:

- The U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics reports that men represent more than 90% of work-related fatalities, being 10 times more likely to die due occupational hazards than women. We constantly hear about the Gender Wage Gap, and how women are paid less than men. And while that is a grave injustice which certainly needs to be addressed, women aren't dying in alarming numbers because of it. The fact that the wage gap gets all the media and academic attention while the gender death gap is swept under the rug and ignored goes to show how skewed our perspective is.

- Feminists and woke media outlets would like you to believe that violence disproportionately affects women, but that is simply not true. According to the CDC, 1 in 3 men experience physical or sexual violence from an intimate partner in their lifetime. According to international law scholar Solange Mouthaan, sexual and domestic violence against men is largely ignored in favor of prioritizing violence against women and children. It is estimated that most male victims of domestic violence never report the violence because of societal expectations of masculinity and fear of being dismissed or ridiculed, and third parties are 3 times as likely to report violence when the victim is female than when the victim is male. Furthermore, men face much higher rates of non-sexual violence than women. According to U.S. crime statistics from 1979 onward, 75% of homicide victims are men. A study predicts that 1 in 2,000 men will be killed by the police, while only 1 in 33,000 women will. Most people think that being raped is significantly more horrific than being stabbed or shot, even though there is no objective standard to determine that. From what I can gather, this belief relies on the circular argument that rape is more horrific because it happens to women, and women face more horrific violence because they are more likely to get raped. And in case you think I'm biased; I have never been stabbed or shot, but I have been raped.

- Men and boys represent the vast majority of deaths in wars. Feminists like to counter this point by bringing up the fact that women are largely barred from serving in the military. In response, I'd like to point out two facts: 1. While it is true that women are unfairly barred from serving in the military, nobody is dying as a result. Making this the priority of the conversation, over all the people who are actually dying every day, is f***ed up! 2. Even among civilians, men and boys were disproportionately targeted in mass killings and genocides like the Rwandan genocide, the Arminian genocide, the Anfal campaign, and many other atrocities. More than 90% of the civilian casualties in the Kosovo War were males.

- Male genital mutilation, often performed on children without their consent, remains legal and normalized in most Western countries.

- Men make 75% of the homeless population. Despite this, when I called a shelter when I was homeless, I was told that they only accept women and children. In other words, I was denied shelter when I was homeless specifically because of my gender. Somebody explain to me how I'm the privileged party in this scenario?! I'm sure somebody will argue that priority is given to women because I possess privileges they don't. What this person won't do is demonstrate or quantify the nature of this nebulous privilege they will assert without justification.

Despite all the above, I and millions of other men like me are constantly told we need to "check our male privilege". And yet, somehow, the same people making these claims never consider that being significantly less likely to become homeless, significantly less likely to die violently, and astronomically less likely to die while working to earn a meager living, constitute female privileges. And that is nothing short of blatant hypocrisy!

I was beaten by my own father before I could even walk. I was subjected to ritual mutilation without my consent. I was raped multiple times by multiple individuals. I was psychologically abused by me ex-fiancé. And then, simply because of my gender, it was assumed that I must have been the abuser. I got so much hate and abuse after my breakup that I nearly ended my own life. I was homeless no less than 5 different times in the past decade. And throughout all of that, I was constantly gaslighted about my experiences due to being a "privileged" male.

So go ahead! Explain to me where the privilege is in all that. I f***ing dare you!



kitesandtrainsandcats
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2016
Age: 58
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,232
Location: Missouri

26 May 2021, 12:17 am

dorkseid wrote:
- Men make 75% of the homeless population. Despite this, when I called a shelter when I was homeless, I was told that they only accept women and children. In other words, I was denied shelter when I was homeless specifically because of my gender.


Yep, have been there and lived that.


_________________
"There are a thousand things that can happen when you go light a rocket engine, and only one of them is good."
Tom Mueller of SpaceX, in Air and Space, Jan. 2011


kitesandtrainsandcats
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2016
Age: 58
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,232
Location: Missouri

26 May 2021, 12:27 am

dorkseid wrote:
According to the CDC, 1 in 3 men experience physical or sexual violence from an intimate partner in their lifetime.


Here's a 13 page booklet about that by the government of Alberta, Canada;
Men Abused by Women in Intimate Relationships
Alberta Human Services
Family Violence Prevention and Homeless Supports
3rd Floor, Sterling Place9940 - 106 Street Edmonton, AB T5K 2N2
Family Violence Info Line: 310-1818
http://www.familyviolence.alberta.ca

Quote:
Men abused by women: it happens and it matters
Between 1999 and 2004, more than half a million men in Canada had a partner who was violent toward them. The partner might have been a wife, an ex-wife or a common-law partner. This means about six per cent of men in intimate relationships have experienced abuse or violence from their partners

http://www.humanservices.alberta.ca/doc ... ooklet.pdf

The closeness of percentages is a point of interest :arrow:
Quote:
Most Canadians do not physically abuse their partners. However, a report that came out in 2006 shows it does happen more than we would like to think. In the survey, about seven per cent of women and six per cent of men said their partners had abused them in the past five years. Women who are abused are more likely to be sexually assaulted, beaten, choked or threatened with a weapon. Men who are abused are more likely to be slapped, kicked, bitten or hit, or have something thrown at them.3Nineteen per cent of men abused by their partners say the violence caused physical injury. Ten per cent of men who experienced violence feared for their lives.


Now, back to the USA, https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-life ... t-20045149

Domestic violence against men isn't always easy to identify, but it can be a serious threat. Know how to recognize if you're being abused — and how to get help.
By Mayo Clinic Staff

Quote:
Women aren't the only victims of domestic violence. Understand the signs of domestic violence against men, and know how to get help.
...
Don't take the blame

You may not be sure whether you're the victim or the abuser. It's common for survivors of domestic violence to act out verbally or physically against the abuser, yelling, pushing, or hitting him or her during conflicts. The abuser may use such incidents to manipulate you, describing them as proof that you are the abusive partner.

You may have developed unhealthy behaviors. Many survivors do. That doesn't mean you are at fault for the abuse.


And now we bring you Germany, https://www.dw.com/en/men-as-victims-of ... a-55472456
Germany
Men as victims of domestic violence: 'I was paralyzed'
Date 02.11.2020
Quote:
Tami's story is similar to that of many of the approximately 26,000 men officially listed as victims of domestic violence in Germany in one year. Official German figures also show that nearly 20% of domestic violence victims are men.

Society doesn't recognize that there are also vulnerable men, men who are not perpetrators but victims, says Elizabeth Bates, a researcher at the University of Cumbria in northern England.


8O :arrow:
Quote:
Tami Weissenberg says the blows he received from his partner were not the worst aspect of their relationship. The pain from the psychological violence went much deeper: "One day, she was standing in front of me and then she took off her bathrobe and was naked. Then she started beating herself, scratching herself, and shouting: 'Stop it! Ow! That hurts!' So, there I was, standing in front of her, immobilized and asking myself: What's this all about? And when she finished her assault, she got back into her bathrobe before pulling a small recorder out of her pocket.

"That really is a fine thing. A little dictating device — it's my joker," she said and left the room. From then on she threatened to blackmail him if he told anybody about her violence. Tami felt paralyzed: "I didn't dare step out of line. I was so scared of losing face in society, of losing out professionally, and of not in any way being seen as a victim but as a perpetrator. And with fear, you can hold people down and lock them in."


:arrow:
Quote:
A global problem

Figures show that men have similar experiences across the globe. Statistics from Mexico suggest that around 25% of all victims of domestic violence are men. In Kenya, Nigeria or Ghana unemployment and poverty regularly trigger violence from female partners. And it is the same story worldwide: Little or no support for male victims — especially in rural areas.


_________________
"There are a thousand things that can happen when you go light a rocket engine, and only one of them is good."
Tom Mueller of SpaceX, in Air and Space, Jan. 2011


Last edited by kitesandtrainsandcats on 26 May 2021, 12:52 am, edited 4 times in total.

kitesandtrainsandcats
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2016
Age: 58
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,232
Location: Missouri

26 May 2021, 12:37 am

dorkseid wrote:
- The U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics reports that men represent more than 90% of work-related fatalities, being 10 times more likely to die due occupational hazards than women.


And another one for those who like documentation; https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm ... story.html
Men Dominate in Workplace Deaths
LAT Archives
Aug. 4, 1995 12 AM PT
Quote:
Labor Secretary Robert B. Reich noted “a striking difference” between the 6,067 male fatalities and just 521 female deaths. “Over 90% of the fatal injuries this past year were men, although men account for only 54% of the nation’s employment,” he said.


And the trend holds true today and holds true in the UK as well as here in the US,
https://www.arcoservices.co.uk/news/blo ... shp-online
"Men 23 times more likely to die in the workplace than women" - SHP Online
Tue 16 Apr 2019
posted by Arco Professional Safety Services

And the trend holds true in Ireland, https://www.irishtimes.com/business/mor ... n-1.143984
More men die at work than women
Fri, Jan 8, 1999, 00:00
Quote:
Men are much more likely than women to be killed or injured at work, according to new figures.
...
In all, 44 men and four women died in the workplace in 1997.

Taken with the provisional figures for 1998, some 100 men and 10 women died in the workplace over the past two years. This suggests that men are 10 times more likely to die in the workplace than women.
...
The Health and Safety Authority (HSA) has also shown The Irish Times provisional figures of accidents by sector and gender for 1998. They reveal that some 4,000 men suffered workplace accidents compared to slightly more than 1,000 women.


Jumping back to more recent years here in the US, https://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/cfoi.pdf
For release 10:00 a.m. (ET) Wednesday, December 16, 2020
NATIONAL CENSUS OF FATAL OCCUPATIONAL INJURIES IN 2019

The trend for "Table 1: Fatal occupational injuries by selected demographic characteristics, 2015-19"
runs, for example 2017, the fatalities were 386 women and 4,761 men.


_________________
"There are a thousand things that can happen when you go light a rocket engine, and only one of them is good."
Tom Mueller of SpaceX, in Air and Space, Jan. 2011


kitesandtrainsandcats
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2016
Age: 58
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,232
Location: Missouri

26 May 2021, 12:59 am

dorkseid wrote:
...but they are treated as literal canon fodder sent out to die on the front lines of wars


and that brings to mind some more documentation, https://academic.oup.com/ejil/article/18/2/253/361968
Oxford University Press
Sexual Violence Against Men in Armed Conflict
Sandesh Sivakumaran
European Journal of International Law, Volume 18, Issue 2, April 2007, Pages 253–276, https://doi.org/10.1093/ejil/chm013
Published:
01 April 2007

Quote:
Abstract Reports of sexual violence by men against men emerge from numerous confl icts, ranging in time from Ancient Persia and the Crusades to the confl icts in Iraq and the Democratic Republic of the Congo. Despite these accounts, relatively little material exists on the subject and the issue tends to be relegated to a footnote. This article ascertains the extent to which male sexual violence is committed in armed confl ict. It considers factors that explain under-reporting by victims and lack of detection on the part of others. The particular forms of male sexual violence are also examined: namely rape, enforced sterilization and other forms of sexual violence, including enforced nudity, enforced masturbation and genital violence. The dynamics present in these offences are explored, with issues of power and dominance, expressed through emasculation, considered. Thus, attention is paid to ideas of feminization, homosexualization and the prevention of procreation. The symbolic construction of male and female bodies in armed conflict is also explored.


Quote:
Sexual violence is committed against men more frequently than is often thought. It is perpetrated at home, in the community and in prison; by men and by women; during conflict and in time of peace. It has been written that, ‘[i]n some respects, the situation facing male rape victims today is not so different from that which faced female victims, say, two centuries ago.’1 Not much has changed in the period since that comment was made. Although there has been some positive development in certain areas,2 there has been little or none in others. One area to which little attention has been paid is sexual violence against men in armed conflict.

Reports of sexual violence by men against men (‘male sexual violence’) emerge from many conflicts. These reports may be buried under a wealth of other information but they are there. They are there in the testimonies of survivors and in the reports of commissions and investigative bodies. They may be hard to find, for survivors will often recall what they witnessed rather than express what they themselves experienced; reports of commissions and investigative bodies will often record the atrocities under the rubric of torture and not sexual violence. Nevertheless, they may be found. Despite these accounts, relatively little material exists on the subject and the numbers remain unclear. We know it exists but we do not know to what extent.

This article examines the issue of male sexual violence in armed conflict. It draws largely from medical and criminological studies of male victims of sexual violence committed in time of peace and analyses of sexual violence committed against women both in time of peace and in time of conflict. It does so, in part, as materials are more readily available in these areas, but more importantly because many of the dynamics present in these offences are largely replicated in male sexual violence in armed conflict.


_________________
"There are a thousand things that can happen when you go light a rocket engine, and only one of them is good."
Tom Mueller of SpaceX, in Air and Space, Jan. 2011


kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 77,137
Location: Queens, NYC

26 May 2021, 9:47 am

All this is still not going to make me take the "red pill."

Some guys have it lousy, just like some women have it lousy.

Sure, men get abused.....and that should be acknowledged.

My life's mission is to MAKE SURE that I don't become "disposable."



IsabellaLinton
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 1 Nov 2017
Gender: Female
Posts: 40,188

26 May 2021, 9:58 am

I agree with you about the disparity, and the lack of education about men's suffering. That's why it's so important to focus on equality, egalitarianism, and treating all human beings with kindness and respect. Gender should never be a determining factor in how we treat or pre-judge others.



Fnord
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2008
Age: 64
Gender: Male
Posts: 50,571
Location: Stendec

26 May 2021, 10:00 am

"It is impossible for a man to be a victim of domestic or spousal abuse." -- Lorena Bobbitt


_________________
 Link to Official List of Trump's Atrocities 

45OFFICE = TRE45ON
Lock Him Up!


kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 77,137
Location: Queens, NYC

26 May 2021, 10:13 am

For context, Lorena Bobbitt was a lady who cut off her husband's "you know what."

It's, in a small sense, akin to saying that people who are oppressed racially cannot be racists themselves.

Indeed, men as victims of domestic violence are not as acknowledged as women who are victims of domestic violence.

What bothers me sometimes is that "being the victim" becomes the dominant motif in a person's life.



IsabellaLinton
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 1 Nov 2017
Gender: Female
Posts: 40,188

26 May 2021, 10:33 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
For context, Lorena Bobbitt was a lady who cut off her husband's "you know what."




and sadly, people joke about it. ^

They don't joke when men maim women.

It's a perfect example of the messed-up mentality some people have about gender.

I have no idea what a red pill is or any of that, and I don't want to know. Obviously it's not OK.

Just live and let live, and treat people with dignity. That's all any human deserves.



kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 77,137
Location: Queens, NYC

26 May 2021, 10:40 am

^Yep....my sentiments, exactly!



carlos55
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 5 Mar 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 787
Location: uk

26 May 2021, 12:40 pm

dorkseid wrote:
TRIGGER WARNING!! ! !This post contains discussions about physical and sexual violence.




I would like to clarify that the purpose of this thread is in no way to deny any struggles women have or continue to experience. After all, I think we can all agree that anyone who would gaslight and deny the struggles of an entire class of people on the basis of their gender is a sh!tty human being. I simply want to shed some light on the oft overlooked struggles and adversity many men face.

With that out of the way, let's begin:

The very first thing I would like to talk about is the social phenomenon known as male disposability. Remember that scene in the Titanic, when women and children are called to board the lifeboats, while the men (with the exception of the wealthy ones like Cal) are ordered to stay behind and die? Remember how several men were gunned down for the crime of not wanting to die? This is actually a fairly common social phenomenon. While an elite minority of men control the wealth and power in a society, the lives of the powerless and impoverished majority of men are considered by society to have significantly less value than those of child-bearing women. Not only is this vast majority of men overworked and underpaid, never getting a foothold in the social hierarchy; but they are treated as literal canon fodder sent out to die on the front lines of wars their neither had any control in the creation of nor benefit from in any way. These foot soldiers are never valued by their generals as anything more than a strategic asset to be sacrificed without a second thought, and often act as human shields to protect their "more important" superior officers. And even in times of peace, the destitute majority of men are commonly relegated to dangerous jobs like mining or construction, that result in high numbers of work-related injuries and fatalities. And to add insult to injury, the men doing these jobs are working for chicken scratch and struggle their whole lives from pay check to pay check. This culling of men is evolutionarily desirable, as it weeds the "unfit" males from the gene pool. It is also desirable by the upper echelon of men who hold power, as it serves to curtail the threat of potential competitors rising to challenge them.

The Apex Fallacy is a logical fallacy in which a group is evaluated according to the performance of only its best/strongest members. An example would be the statement that all basketball players are as skilled as Michael Jordan or Lebron James. Which is, of course, equally as absurd as arguing that because all cows are mammals, all mammals therefore must be cows. In relation to the male privilege argument, woke culture looks at who possesses the wealth and power in our society and sees that its mostly men, then concludes from that that all men are privileged. When the reality is that most of what it commonly described as male privilege is limited to the very small percentage of men at the top.

Now, let's look at some of the facts that woke culture doesn't want you to know about:

- The U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics reports that men represent more than 90% of work-related fatalities, being 10 times more likely to die due occupational hazards than women. We constantly hear about the Gender Wage Gap, and how women are paid less than men. And while that is a grave injustice which certainly needs to be addressed, women aren't dying in alarming numbers because of it. The fact that the wage gap gets all the media and academic attention while the gender death gap is swept under the rug and ignored goes to show how skewed our perspective is.

- Feminists and woke media outlets would like you to believe that violence disproportionately affects women, but that is simply not true. According to the CDC, 1 in 3 men experience physical or sexual violence from an intimate partner in their lifetime. According to international law scholar Solange Mouthaan, sexual and domestic violence against men is largely ignored in favor of prioritizing violence against women and children. It is estimated that most male victims of domestic violence never report the violence because of societal expectations of masculinity and fear of being dismissed or ridiculed, and third parties are 3 times as likely to report violence when the victim is female than when the victim is male. Furthermore, men face much higher rates of non-sexual violence than women. According to U.S. crime statistics from 1979 onward, 75% of homicide victims are men. A study predicts that 1 in 2,000 men will be killed by the police, while only 1 in 33,000 women will. Most people think that being raped is significantly more horrific than being stabbed or shot, even though there is no objective standard to determine that. From what I can gather, this belief relies on the circular argument that rape is more horrific because it happens to women, and women face more horrific violence because they are more likely to get raped. And in case you think I'm biased; I have never been stabbed or shot, but I have been raped.

- Men and boys represent the vast majority of deaths in wars. Feminists like to counter this point by bringing up the fact that women are largely barred from serving in the military. In response, I'd like to point out two facts: 1. While it is true that women are unfairly barred from serving in the military, nobody is dying as a result. Making this the priority of the conversation, over all the people who are actually dying every day, is f***ed up! 2. Even among civilians, men and boys were disproportionately targeted in mass killings and genocides like the Rwandan genocide, the Arminian genocide, the Anfal campaign, and many other atrocities. More than 90% of the civilian casualties in the Kosovo War were males.

- Male genital mutilation, often performed on children without their consent, remains legal and normalized in most Western countries.

- Men make 75% of the homeless population. Despite this, when I called a shelter when I was homeless, I was told that they only accept women and children. In other words, I was denied shelter when I was homeless specifically because of my gender. Somebody explain to me how I'm the privileged party in this scenario?! I'm sure somebody will argue that priority is given to women because I possess privileges they don't. What this person won't do is demonstrate or quantify the nature of this nebulous privilege they will assert without justification.

Despite all the above, I and millions of other men like me are constantly told we need to "check our male privilege". And yet, somehow, the same people making these claims never consider that being significantly less likely to become homeless, significantly less likely to die violently, and astronomically less likely to die while working to earn a meager living, constitute female privileges. And that is nothing short of blatant hypocrisy!

I was beaten by my own father before I could even walk. I was subjected to ritual mutilation without my consent. I was raped multiple times by multiple individuals. I was psychologically abused by me ex-fiancé. And then, simply because of my gender, it was assumed that I must have been the abuser. I got so much hate and abuse after my breakup that I nearly ended my own life. I was homeless no less than 5 different times in the past decade. And throughout all of that, I was constantly gaslighted about my experiences due to being a "privileged" male.

So go ahead! Explain to me where the privilege is in all that. I f***ing dare you!


Leaving aside the transgender debate humans are born either male or female in bodies, so its not like there`s lots of variables its literally 50/50

Males are physically stronger & more powerful and on average they have a greater predisposition to the physicality pursuit of sex.

Women by contrast are on average physically smaller, weaker & more discerning in relation to sexual contact and are more likely to be vulnerable in other ways such as being a primary child carer or physically pregnant.

So the extra protections given to women are a recognition to those facts.



AardvarkGoodSwimmer
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Apr 2009
Gender: Male
Posts: 7,317
Location: Houston, Texas

26 May 2021, 1:30 pm

dorkseid wrote:

I was beaten by my own father before I could even walk. I was subjected to ritual mutilation without my consent. I was raped multiple times by multiple individuals. I was psychologically abused by me ex-fiancé. And then, simply because of my gender, it was assumed that I must have been the abuser. I got so much hate and abuse after my breakup that I nearly ended my own life. I was homeless no less than 5 different times in the past decade. And throughout all of that, I was constantly gaslighted about my experiences due to being a "privileged" male.

So go ahead! Explain to me where the privilege is in all that. I f***ing dare you!

I'm sorry all this abusive stuff happened to you.

I'm right between 5'5" and 5'6", slightly build, a squirely guy, of course, I am, I'm Aspie.

I was never raped, and I count myself lucky. When I was 11, a cousin who was about 16 taught me how to masturbate. He did not mean bad, but it was too damn early.

When I was age 19 living in a college dorm, this older gay student briefly liked me, which is perfectly okay. The problem was that his boyfriend "joked" about raping me. And because of one idiot on my dorm floor who found this funny for a day or two, about a half dozen other people did as well. Even though only talked about for a day or two, never quite sure it was over. What I did not have was a physically large friend who would talk with said boyfriend briefly and seriously, and warn him off. I wish I had had that.



dorkseid
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 28 Jun 2020
Gender: Male
Posts: 825
Location: Tarkon Galtos

26 May 2021, 5:37 pm



XFilesGeek
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator

User avatar

Joined: 24 Jul 2010
Age: 38
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 6,031
Location: The Oort Cloud

26 May 2021, 5:43 pm

carlos55 wrote:
dorkseid wrote:
TRIGGER WARNING!! ! !This post contains discussions about physical and sexual violence.




I would like to clarify that the purpose of this thread is in no way to deny any struggles women have or continue to experience. After all, I think we can all agree that anyone who would gaslight and deny the struggles of an entire class of people on the basis of their gender is a sh!tty human being. I simply want to shed some light on the oft overlooked struggles and adversity many men face.

With that out of the way, let's begin:

The very first thing I would like to talk about is the social phenomenon known as male disposability. Remember that scene in the Titanic, when women and children are called to board the lifeboats, while the men (with the exception of the wealthy ones like Cal) are ordered to stay behind and die? Remember how several men were gunned down for the crime of not wanting to die? This is actually a fairly common social phenomenon. While an elite minority of men control the wealth and power in a society, the lives of the powerless and impoverished majority of men are considered by society to have significantly less value than those of child-bearing women. Not only is this vast majority of men overworked and underpaid, never getting a foothold in the social hierarchy; but they are treated as literal canon fodder sent out to die on the front lines of wars their neither had any control in the creation of nor benefit from in any way. These foot soldiers are never valued by their generals as anything more than a strategic asset to be sacrificed without a second thought, and often act as human shields to protect their "more important" superior officers. And even in times of peace, the destitute majority of men are commonly relegated to dangerous jobs like mining or construction, that result in high numbers of work-related injuries and fatalities. And to add insult to injury, the men doing these jobs are working for chicken scratch and struggle their whole lives from pay check to pay check. This culling of men is evolutionarily desirable, as it weeds the "unfit" males from the gene pool. It is also desirable by the upper echelon of men who hold power, as it serves to curtail the threat of potential competitors rising to challenge them.

The Apex Fallacy is a logical fallacy in which a group is evaluated according to the performance of only its best/strongest members. An example would be the statement that all basketball players are as skilled as Michael Jordan or Lebron James. Which is, of course, equally as absurd as arguing that because all cows are mammals, all mammals therefore must be cows. In relation to the male privilege argument, woke culture looks at who possesses the wealth and power in our society and sees that its mostly men, then concludes from that that all men are privileged. When the reality is that most of what it commonly described as male privilege is limited to the very small percentage of men at the top.

Now, let's look at some of the facts that woke culture doesn't want you to know about:

- The U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics reports that men represent more than 90% of work-related fatalities, being 10 times more likely to die due occupational hazards than women. We constantly hear about the Gender Wage Gap, and how women are paid less than men. And while that is a grave injustice which certainly needs to be addressed, women aren't dying in alarming numbers because of it. The fact that the wage gap gets all the media and academic attention while the gender death gap is swept under the rug and ignored goes to show how skewed our perspective is.

- Feminists and woke media outlets would like you to believe that violence disproportionately affects women, but that is simply not true. According to the CDC, 1 in 3 men experience physical or sexual violence from an intimate partner in their lifetime. According to international law scholar Solange Mouthaan, sexual and domestic violence against men is largely ignored in favor of prioritizing violence against women and children. It is estimated that most male victims of domestic violence never report the violence because of societal expectations of masculinity and fear of being dismissed or ridiculed, and third parties are 3 times as likely to report violence when the victim is female than when the victim is male. Furthermore, men face much higher rates of non-sexual violence than women. According to U.S. crime statistics from 1979 onward, 75% of homicide victims are men. A study predicts that 1 in 2,000 men will be killed by the police, while only 1 in 33,000 women will. Most people think that being raped is significantly more horrific than being stabbed or shot, even though there is no objective standard to determine that. From what I can gather, this belief relies on the circular argument that rape is more horrific because it happens to women, and women face more horrific violence because they are more likely to get raped. And in case you think I'm biased; I have never been stabbed or shot, but I have been raped.

- Men and boys represent the vast majority of deaths in wars. Feminists like to counter this point by bringing up the fact that women are largely barred from serving in the military. In response, I'd like to point out two facts: 1. While it is true that women are unfairly barred from serving in the military, nobody is dying as a result. Making this the priority of the conversation, over all the people who are actually dying every day, is f***ed up! 2. Even among civilians, men and boys were disproportionately targeted in mass killings and genocides like the Rwandan genocide, the Arminian genocide, the Anfal campaign, and many other atrocities. More than 90% of the civilian casualties in the Kosovo War were males.

- Male genital mutilation, often performed on children without their consent, remains legal and normalized in most Western countries.

- Men make 75% of the homeless population. Despite this, when I called a shelter when I was homeless, I was told that they only accept women and children. In other words, I was denied shelter when I was homeless specifically because of my gender. Somebody explain to me how I'm the privileged party in this scenario?! I'm sure somebody will argue that priority is given to women because I possess privileges they don't. What this person won't do is demonstrate or quantify the nature of this nebulous privilege they will assert without justification.

Despite all the above, I and millions of other men like me are constantly told we need to "check our male privilege". And yet, somehow, the same people making these claims never consider that being significantly less likely to become homeless, significantly less likely to die violently, and astronomically less likely to die while working to earn a meager living, constitute female privileges. And that is nothing short of blatant hypocrisy!

I was beaten by my own father before I could even walk. I was subjected to ritual mutilation without my consent. I was raped multiple times by multiple individuals. I was psychologically abused by me ex-fiancé. And then, simply because of my gender, it was assumed that I must have been the abuser. I got so much hate and abuse after my breakup that I nearly ended my own life. I was homeless no less than 5 different times in the past decade. And throughout all of that, I was constantly gaslighted about my experiences due to being a "privileged" male.

So go ahead! Explain to me where the privilege is in all that. I f***ing dare you!


Leaving aside the transgender debate humans are born either male or female in bodies, so its not like there`s lots of variables its literally 50/50

Males are physically stronger & more powerful and on average they have a greater predisposition to the physicality pursuit of sex.

Women by contrast are on average physically smaller, weaker & more discerning in relation to sexual contact and are more likely to be vulnerable in other ways such as being a primary child carer or physically pregnant.

So the extra protections given to women are a recognition to those facts.


"Women and children first" is a myth. Statistically, men are much more likely to survive both natural and maritime disasters.

The Titanic is one of the few examples of female survivors outnumbering male survivors.


_________________
"If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced."

-XFG (no longer a moderator)


Dear_one
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Feb 2008
Age: 72
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,904
Location: Where the Great Plains meet the Northern Pines

26 May 2021, 6:20 pm

dorkseid wrote:
The very first thing I would like to talk about is the social phenomenon known as male disposability.


Thanks for a fine post. This seems to me to be far deeper than a "social" phenomenon. It is one of the things that stays the same while many other social norms change.
Fred Hapgood has written whole books about this topic. A quick summary can start with comparing two sub-species of proto-humans. One values men and women equally, and one is like us. That other group will die out for many reasons. After each disaster, be it war or from nature, their population will take longer to bounce back, because with us, one surviving male can impregnate many women.
Accepting risky work is one way that men can seem more desirable to women, as well as providing a true test of fitness. That makes it easier for our tribe's women to choose the best fathers. Genetics has shown that they do that a lot. You have twice as many female ancestors as males - many men had few or no children, and some were wildly successful. Ten percent of the time, a woman chooses one man for the genes, and another for support. This avoids wasting infertile men, and encourages bloodlines that are good for the community but bad at fatherhood, such as heroes who die young, traders, and troubadours.
To cuckold men 10% of the time, Ma Nature gave women the power to out-argue men with rhetorical tricks, etc, and this let them easily promote the apex fallacy, while burying many other issues you bring up. One Canadian scandal is the Inquiry into Missing and Murdered Indigenous Women and Girls. The problem is that there are twice as many men and boys gone, and we can't get them any publicity at all as a group. If a woman gets bruises, she gets plenty of help, but if a man is ruined by lies, nobody can tell, so he stays down a long time.
As a man, your "privilege" is to be able to handle bigger risks and possibly win bigger prizes. I don't think it is unfair that women are seldom assigned combat roles. There are always exceptions, but there are far too many stories about them becoming a liability just when they are needed to be steady.