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rabo
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18 Jul 2021, 10:47 am

As far as I know, most politicians seem to be neurotypical. Most people agree, the way politicians talk should be (more or less) on a rational basis; the result of such politics should be somehow logical or understandable. Maybe that idea does not fit all politicians, e.g. Donald Trump never was "logical" anyhow. But as this is not an article on Trump, we might ignore him for the moment.

Yet, the result of politics is sometimes very poor. Maybe it would be a good idea to have some autistic persons in politics, cause they might be much more sensitive to the messages themselves, and less susceptible to the way the statements are presented.

Let's take the discussion about climatic changes as an example. If we agree* that the emission of CO2 causes the climatic changes and if we agree* that we should minimise the output of CO2, then we do not have many options. We have exactly two ways of resolving the problem:
1) Emitting less CO2
2) Turning CO2 into O2.
Turning CO2 into O2 can be done by forests or by machines that might be invented.

This said, politicians, have a very clear defined task to resolve. As they seem to be primarily neurotypical, one might assume, that they can do it. If you have a closer look at the problem, you will find out, that it is different. There are "good guys" and "bad guys" in the arena. There is also a certain hierarchy in the discussion. If the president of the US says something, it is considered to be interesting. If the president of a "Third world Country" says something, it is often ignored.

Lets take the Brasilien president Bolsonaro. He is a guy that I certainly do NOT like. Nevertheless, sometimes he might tell the truth. In 2018 0r 2019, he argued that the Brasilians have all rights to do whatever they want with the Amazon Forest. He also said, that the industrialised nations should be quiet on that topic, as they already cut their own woods centuries ago.

As I already said: I DO NOT like him. And additionally, I am an ecologist. So I did not like what he said but had to admit, that he was basically right. And he added another essential piece of information: If the industrial countries want to have the oxygen produced by the Amazon forest, they will have to pay for it.

Sorry. For me, that message was obvious and easy to understand. He wanted money. Is it necessary to be autistic to understand that? Most politicians did not follow his arguments and turned the topic into something moralistic. They preferred to discuss how the message was delivered, and who delivered it, instead of discussing the message itself.

Maybe it needs an autistic person to make some simple mathematics:
1) How much CO2 is turned into O2 by the Amazon Forests?
2) How much are the costs of achieving the same result with other means?
3) We have a price and can start to negotiate.

Does that idea make any sense to you? Sometimes I think, that neurotypicals do not do things better (as they claim). They just make other mistakes than we do, and they outweigh us by number. That is why their decisions seem to be better accepted.

Just have a look at Greta Thunberg. I do not want to discuss her points of view here. But one thing is sure: She sticks to a problem until it is resolved. Yea, but she is an autist. ;) Should not there be more of us in politics?


* If you disagree with the theory of CO2 causing climatic changes, it is no problem. But please do not discuss, this idea in this thread. I want to talk about the way politicians communicate, not about physics/ science.



Mona Pereth
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18 Jul 2021, 2:47 pm

The big problem in politics is what politicians need in order to get elected. They need:

1) Money for campaign ads, get-out-the-vote drives, etc.
2) Organized groups of people who are likely to support them and be a source of campaign volunteers.

Therefore, most politicians need some combination of:

1) Wealthy donors willing to commit to supporting them.
2) Organized grassroots groups whose causes the politician favors, and who are willing to endorse the politician for that reason.

Therefore, politicians need to be able to win the favor of both (1) wealthy donors and (2) the leaders of grassroots organizations.

Thus, politicians in general need well-above-average social skills. Although it's not impossible for a rare few autistic people to be politicians, autistic people in general are not likely to succeed as politicians.

Autistic people can more easily play various other roles in politics, however.

For example, we can play various roles within the afore-mentioned grassroots organizations. We can even be (and, I suspect, often are) among the creators of new grassroots movements.

Some of us, like Greta Thunberg, can be among the leading figures within established political causes. But more of us would be better suited to more low-key roles.


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rabo
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18 Jul 2021, 4:04 pm

Mona Pereth wrote:
Some of us, like Greta Thunberg, can be among the leading figures within established political causes. But more of us would be better suited to more low-key roles.


I agree partly with you. But I could imagine Grete Thunberg being a minister (e.g of the environment) in Sweden once she will be old enough. And I think, she would do a good job in this position. As I said: She has some qualities other people do not have. Therefore I am not sure if the "low-key roles" are all that should be reserved for autists.



shlaifu
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18 Jul 2021, 6:45 pm

the thing about politicians is that their actual job is not really what's commonly thought of as being their job.- the actual job of a politician, by which his success is measured and which decides whether he or she gets reelected is simply to *get elected*. all else is secondary.
so, yes, autistic people in politics might be a good idea to get things done.
but getting things done is secondary and not a necessary tequirement for *getting elected*


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Mona Pereth
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18 Jul 2021, 8:20 pm

rabo wrote:
I agree partly with you. But I could imagine Grete Thunberg being a minister (e.g of the environment) in Sweden once she will be old enough. And I think, she would do a good job in this position.

Is that an elected position or an appointed position? If it's an appointed position, without the overhead of needing to get elected, she might do well at that.

rabo wrote:
As I said: She has some qualities other people do not have. Therefore I am not sure if the "low-key roles" are all that should be reserved for autists.

I didn't say all of us should be limited to low-key roles, but most of us would probably do better in low-key roles.


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Brictoria
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18 Jul 2021, 9:08 pm

One important consideration is that politicians tend to have a need to be "economical with the truth" at times, which many Autists might have issue with.

For example:
Stating masks were not required by the public, in order to ensure there were enough available for health practitioners, despite their use by the public at that time having the potential to greatly slow\stop the spread of a virus.

While some Autists may be able to succesfully do this, in many cases either the person would be unable to proceed with statements such as this which are counter to the facts (or beliefs) they have, or if able to make such statements, would be unable to do so convincingly due to those same reasons.


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ezbzbfcg2
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19 Jul 2021, 3:11 am

Ideally, yes.

Reality: Likeability and schmoozing is more indicative of political success.



rabo
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19 Jul 2021, 4:33 am

Well, that is really an interesting discussion! Le's break it down to one basic question: Could (autistic) Greta Thunberg - if she were old enough - become minister of environment in Sweden? Would her autism be helpful in that situation or not?

I do a short summary of the main arguments:
- Brictoria said that always saying the truth is a major problem as politicians cannot always say the truth.
- Mona Pereth said, that Thunberg could not be elected, but appointed to her position.

@ truth:
Yes. That is right. Sometimes it is even necessary to lie. E. g. if you know that telling the truth might create a mass panic you have to lie in order to avoid the mass panic and save people one by one. On the other hand, people are fed up with politicians lying.

@elected: That one I do not understand. sorry. Why she cannot be elected? On the other hand: Yes. To be elected you have to argue a little bit different in different places. You have to say that NY is the most beautiful town in the world while you are in NY, and you have to say the same about Los Angeles, if you speak in front of an audience there. That is not lying, that is called being polite. Maybe that is not possible for an autist.

But generally: The main point in the presentation of Thunberg is, that she is 1000% authentic. That is her BIG, BIG advantage and that is also part of her autism, I guess. She is not a scientist that discovered new facts. She is just an authentic girl that reads reports on scientific papers. And I think she could attract people by being authentic. Therefore I could imagine autists as part of a team of politicians very well. The autist might have the role of the "100% reliable person".

The challenge might be rather to find autistic people that want to do that job. Politicians are always in focus of the media. I for example could not stand that.



rabo
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22 Jul 2021, 11:52 am

I wrote a longer blog article on that topic in my own blog. As I am new to this forum, I prefer to ask the moderation first: Is it OK to link to your own blog? Are there any rules for that?

I read somewhere, that you are allowed to link only one time to your own website. That is OK, but for discussions, that is not really a good choice. So please inform me, how to go on.

Thanks!



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22 Jul 2021, 5:35 pm

The top, elite, of politics has no need for people with possibly not getting the plan. Control over population, mind games, lies/deception, charisma, saying things in order to manipulate people and do something else, without remorse.



rabo
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23 Jul 2021, 3:55 am

I don't think like that. Absolutely not.

In the first place, autism does not mean that one does not get the plan. It is the opposite. Autists get much more information in certain areas. Not all of them can process the information they receive. Others can do it, but is harder for them than for neurotypical people, I think. Those are the high-functional autists, as far as I know.

Secondly, I do not believe that all politicians are corrupted gangsters and part of a special elite. Some are, some are not.