The problem of Nazi/Mandatory vaxx and mask comparisons

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ASPartOfMe
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12 Oct 2021, 10:01 pm

Anger as protesters compare vaccines to Nazi horrors in France

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A French Holocaust survivor has denounced anti-vaxxer protesters making “hateful” comparisons between themselves and Jews who were persecuted by Nazi Germany during World War II, as part of a backlash against new rules mandating COVID vaccinations for healthcare workers.

As more than 100,000 people marched around France against the Macron government’s vaccine rules on Saturday, some demonstrators wore yellow stars resembling those the Nazis forced Jews to wear.
Nurses hold placards as they march during an anti-vaccine protest in Paris on the weekend.

Others carried signs evoking the Auschwitz death camp or South Africa’s apartheid regime, claiming the French government was unfairly mistreating them with its anti-pandemic measures.

“You can’t imagine how much that upset me. This comparison is hateful. We must all rise up against this ignominy,” Holocaust survivor Joseph Szwarc said on Sunday during a ceremony commemorating victims of antisemitic and racist acts by the French state, which collaborated with Adolf Hitler’s regime.

“I wore the star, I know what that is, I still have it in my flesh. It is everyone’s duty to not allow this outrageous, antisemitic, racist wave to pass over us.”


Australian anti-vaxxer dons anti-Semitic symbol, deletes social media
Quote:
A well-known Australian anti-vaxxer has taken down her social media accounts after posting a disturbing photo of her family online.

Sarah Mills, a mother of three from regional NSW with a collective following of more than 100,000 across Instagram, TikTok, and Facebook, posted the images to her accounts as Greater Sydney came out of lockdown yesterday.

In the photos, she can be seen smiling with her children while wearing yellow patches in the shape of the Star of David. A proud symbol of Judaism, a version it was infamously used by the Nazis to identify Jewish people and mark them as an "enemy of the people".

Where the Nazi patches had the word "Jude" (German for Jew), Mills wrote "no vax" before attaching the stars to her and her children's T-shirts.


Connecticut lawmaker compares governor to Hitler, refuses to apologize
Quote:
A Connecticut lawmaker compared Gov. Ned Lamont to Nazi dictator Adolf Hitler over the state’s vaccine policy, saying “this is no longer land of the free.”

“King Lamont aka Hitler dictating what we must inject into our bodies to feed our family!” Dauphinais wrote in a reply late Thursday to a Facebook post by CT News Junkie.

Dauphinais then doubled down in a subsequent Facebook post Friday, claiming Lamont was calling on vaccinated people to discriminate against their unvaccinated counterparts


Featured Post Comparing vaccine mandates to Nazi experiments is appalling
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As the Covid vaccine mandate for New York’s health care and education workers went into effect recently, a legal form making the rounds on social media and online caught my eye.

“By authority of the Nuremberg Code on Medical Experimentation, I do hereby exercise my right to refuse to submit to or to administer the Covid 19 experimental gene therapy injection heretofore known as the ‘Covid 19 Vaccine’… [Medical personnel] are hereby put on notice that any further effort to coerce, intimidate, persuade, trick or compel me to receive any experimental gene therapy injection… implicates you as aiding and abetting in the capital offense of a crime against humanity.”

The reach of that legal form, which is available for all to download, may be limited. But the thought behind it – that the ongoing resistance to Covid vaccines can somehow be tied to the Nuremberg Code and inhumane Nazi medical experiments – is widespread enough that it demands a reiteration of the historical record.

Eighty years ago, in 1941, inmates in Auschwitz were first used by Nazi doctors as live medical experiment subjects. These early trials focused on researching the tolerance level and effectiveness of new medical preparations and drugs. Soon thereafter, Jewish women imprisoned in Auschwitz’s Block 10 were subjected to heinous sterilization and castration experiments. It was also at that time that Dr. Josef Mengele launched his experiments on twins, pregnant women, and others he deemed interesting. The SS Hygienic Institute, which operated out of Auschwitz, focused on infectious diseases.

The list of Nazi medical experiments is terrifyingly long. Historians have found nearly 30,000 Jewish victims, and that number likely is a vast undercount.

Even the most basic reading of the Nuremburg Code makes clear that Nazi medical crimes – the only time in modern history when medicine was deliberately employed as a genocidal tool – simply do not belong in any discussion about Covid vaccine mandates.

Victims of Nazi medical experiments, to be absolutely clear, never had a choice.

imprisoned, malnourished, exhausted and frightened, they were unwillingly selected for medical trials they knew nothing about. No word of explanation, or care of any kind, was given before they were sterilized, or inoculated with a chemical substance, or operated upon. No word of explanation or care came after, either. No attention whatsoever was given to their suffering. If they survived, they were the lucky ones. Refusal meant death.

“Our refusal would ultimately mean that we would be transported to Birkenau, and everybody knew that people were gassed in Birkenau,” one survivor recounted.

Not a single person was forced to partake in a Covid vaccine trial. Not a single person is being forcefully immunized against Covid. And not a single person will face the gas chambers if they choose to not get vaccinated against Covid.


This is the inventable result of two phenomena. The overuse of Nazi comparisons has been going on for so long few think twice about it. The conflating of "microaggressions" an actual offense has caused a situation whereby when people do complain about actual offense they get ignored or put in the whiny snowflakes category.

Lets discuss appropration. That has become a big no-no in certain circles recently. "Nothing About Us Without Us" has turned into "Everything about us has to be only by us". I am not automatically offended by NT's playing autistic characters or gentiles telling Jewish jokes. Those jokes should be funny and the character should be a homage or an accurate portrayal of a historical figure. The usage of the yellow star is anything but that. All the use of the yellow star for shock value does is minimize what it was originally used for.

A pet peeve of mine is using your kids to make political statements. The fact that Ms. Mills blanked out her kids' faces and deleted her social media accounts means that she gets it on some level. Not enough though Ms. Mills is an influencer people will figure out who her kids are. This was one of the if not the most egregious use of one's children to make a political statement that I have seen.


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Mr Reynholm
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13 Oct 2021, 2:33 pm

The same people who were shouting "RESIST!!" during the Trump years are now demanding complete compliance with authoritarian government mandates.



Misslizard
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13 Oct 2021, 4:51 pm

It totally trivializes the Holocaust.
People’s lives were horribly taken from them, the vaccine is to save lives.


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13 Oct 2021, 9:40 pm

The problem is, people nowadays are beyond stupid. It doesn't take much thought to come to the conclusion that these two things are in no way comparable, but it's clear that thinking is hard for certain people. If anything, it just goes to show the real tragedy that truly upstanding citizens died so that people like that could live.

I bet if today's people were alive in WWII, they would be spreading propaganda that the war is a hoax, resisting any attempts at conscription and/or placing people in jobs to support the war efforts, and generally showing just how unpatriotic they really are. People of that generation got shipped sometimes halfway around the world, put their lives on the line and often died because they believed in the future of their country. People nowadays can't even just get a jab to save lives. That's just how sad and pathetic our species has become.



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14 Oct 2021, 9:31 am

Tross wrote:
I bet if today's people were alive in WWII, they would be ... resisting any attempts at conscription ...


There were conscientious objectors in World Wars 1 and 2.
They were for the most part respected because the values of the enlightenment had not been entirely forgotten at that point.

It was the totalitarian regimes that broadly persecuted conscientious objectors.

Do you understand?
Supremacy of the individual conscience is a cornerstone of Western Civilisation.

A person must not be subjected to medical treatment without their full, free, and informed consent.
Vaccination is a medical procedure, thus, forcing a person to be vaccinated against their will violates them.

It's not that different to rape. It's someone saying

Quote:
You don't have any say over your own body, I'm going to put this into your body, and you have no say, your opinion doesn't interest me. Submit or be hurt until you submit.


Wether the, This, is a penis, or a needle full of mystery substance X, doesn't change the fundamental violation of bodily autonomy.

And you wont really grasp it, because you like the vaccine, so you wont understand why it's mandation is bad.

So lets change it a little.
A government duly elected by the people, decides that being gay is bad, and starts mandating drugs to suppress the sex drive of people deemed, deviants.

You'll say "oh but I don't mind gay people, so forcibly using drugs to castrate them. That would be kind of evil!"

Um, notice that word "mandated!" your opinion and personal conscience doesn't interest them, you have abrogated your say, such matters are for the leaders now. Not people like you.

Just as the leaders mandated the vaccine that you approve of, they mandated anti-gay drugs, that you disapprove of.

But note that in both of the above cases, your opinion about your own body, didn't matter, that's what you give up in that scenario, your right of individual conscience.
You're rights to your own body.

This is one reason why vaccine mandates are bad.



ASPartOfMe
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14 Oct 2021, 3:07 pm

SpiceWolf wrote:

It's not that different to rape. It's someone saying

You don't have any say over your own body, I'm going to put this into your body, and you have no say, your opinion doesn't interest me. Submit or be hurt until you submit.

Wether the, This, is a penis, or a needle full of mystery substance X, doesn't change the fundamental violation of bodily autonomy.

And you wont really grasp it, because you like the vaccine, so you wont understand why it's mandation is bad.

Um, in a post about Nazi comparisons you just compared getting vaccinated to rape. First of all rape with rare exceptions is going to hurt a hell of lot more. Second of all unlike rape nobody has a gun to you head saying submit or the nurse giving you a vaccine is not physically overpowering you. The consequences of not taking a vaccine involve not having access to certain activities and places and maybe employment not death or severe injury as with rape.

SpiceWolf wrote:
So lets change it a little.
A government duly elected by the people, decides that being gay is bad, and starts mandating drugs to suppress the sex drive of people deemed, deviants.

You'll say "oh but I don't mind gay people, so forcibly using drugs to castrate them. That would be kind of evil!"

Um, notice that word "mandated!" your opinion and personal conscience doesn't interest them, you have abrogated your say, such matters are for the leaders now. Not people like you.

Just as the leaders mandated the vaccine that you approve of, they mandated anti-gay drugs, that you disapprove of.

But note that in both of the above cases, your opinion about your own body, didn't matter, that's what you give up in that scenario, your right of individual conscience.
You're rights to your own body.

This is one reason why vaccine mandates are bad.

Lets change gay to autistic or not, it’s up to you. The consequences of not taking the treatments would be a similar denial of access. Being mandated to change your sexual orientation or neurology is being mandated to change a part of who you are which is not the case with COVID.

And being gay or being autistic is not contagious.


You want to argue people getting sick, dying, or long term disabled is tough but it should be an acceptable price of freedom of choice is an argument I would disagree with but a valid one. Comparing vaccine mandates to the Third Reich or rape is not.


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Tross
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14 Oct 2021, 5:53 pm

SpiceWolf wrote:
Tross wrote:
I bet if today's people were alive in WWII, they would be ... resisting any attempts at conscription ...


There were conscientious objectors in World Wars 1 and 2.
They were for the most part respected because the values of the enlightenment had not been entirely forgotten at that point.

It was the totalitarian regimes that broadly persecuted conscientious objectors.

Do you understand?
Supremacy of the individual conscience is a cornerstone of Western Civilisation.

A person must not be subjected to medical treatment without their full, free, and informed consent.
Vaccination is a medical procedure, thus, forcing a person to be vaccinated against their will violates them.

It's not that different to rape. It's someone saying

Quote:
You don't have any say over your own body, I'm going to put this into your body, and you have no say, your opinion doesn't interest me. Submit or be hurt until you submit.


Wether the, This, is a penis, or a needle full of mystery substance X, doesn't change the fundamental violation of bodily autonomy.

And you wont really grasp it, because you like the vaccine, so you wont understand why it's mandation is bad.

So lets change it a little.
A government duly elected by the people, decides that being gay is bad, and starts mandating drugs to suppress the sex drive of people deemed, deviants.

You'll say "oh but I don't mind gay people, so forcibly using drugs to castrate them. That would be kind of evil!"

Um, notice that word "mandated!" your opinion and personal conscience doesn't interest them, you have abrogated your say, such matters are for the leaders now. Not people like you.

Just as the leaders mandated the vaccine that you approve of, they mandated anti-gay drugs, that you disapprove of.

But note that in both of the above cases, your opinion about your own body, didn't matter, that's what you give up in that scenario, your right of individual conscience.
You're rights to your own body.

This is one reason why vaccine mandates are bad.
Except there are no vaccine mandates, just bylaws that state that "if you don't have a vaccine, you can't do ____". Also, that doesn't change the fact that once upon a time, people wanted to do their part for their country, but now people are just selfish and entitled. Regardless though, nothing about current regulations is in any way comparable to the Holocaust for anyone who understands what the Holocaust was. :roll:

Seriously though, no one's being held down and having the vaccine forcibly injected into them, so the dissenters aren't having any rights violated. They're given a choice, just one that has consequences. If sticking by some principle or making some point is more important to them than going to restaurants, bars, movie theatres, concerts, sporting events, etc., then so be it. As for the people who are holding off on education or even leaving their jobs over current mandates, note that it's also 100% on them, and they're 100% to blame if any negative consequences arrive as a result of that decision. :roll:



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15 Oct 2021, 3:56 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:
[
Um, in a post about Nazi comparisons you just compared getting vaccinated to rape.


No I compared Cooerced vaccination with rape. I'm no anti vaxxer. I am a health professional who takes the concept of medical ethics very seriously.

I remind you that the difference between making love and rape is consent.



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15 Oct 2021, 8:56 am

SpiceWolf wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
[
Um, in a post about Nazi comparisons you just compared getting vaccinated to rape.


No I compared Cooerced vaccination with rape. I'm no anti vaxxer. I am a health professional who takes the concept of medical ethics very seriously.

I remind you that the difference between making love and rape is consent.

Comparing coercion involved in a rape or being forced into the gas chambers with the degree of coercion involved with the current vaccine mandates is similar to comparing the amount of pain involved in pulling your hamstring getting massive burns all over your body. They are both pain and coercion but that is about all they have in common, they are very different experiences with very different recovery periods.

If you are physically overwhelmed by a rapist you have no choice. With the current vaccine mandates you still have a choice.

And the more people choose not to take the vaccine not only do they have to suffer consequences they are making the choices of others especially those vulnerable to COVID more difficult.


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Last edited by ASPartOfMe on 15 Oct 2021, 9:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

SpiceWolf
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15 Oct 2021, 9:02 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:
If you are physically overwhelmed by a rapist you have no choice. With the current vaccine mandates you still have a choice.


Would you apply that same reasoning to Harvey Weinsteins rapes? After all he didn't hold the women down and physically overwhelm them.



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15 Oct 2021, 9:09 am

Is requiring your employees to wash their hands also a rape-like violation of their bodily freedoms?
Serious question - where are the limit lines?


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15 Oct 2021, 9:11 am

What about seat belt laws and requiring children to ride in car seats?


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15 Oct 2021, 9:12 am

SpiceWolf wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
If you are physically overwhelmed by a rapist you have no choice. With the current vaccine mandates you still have a choice.


Would you apply that same reasoning to Harvey Weinsteins rapes? After all he didn't hold the women down and physically overwhelm them.

Weinstein’s victims had a choice but either the consequences or the perceived consequences were much more severe then the known mandated consequences of refusing the jab.


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15 Oct 2021, 9:18 am

magz wrote:
Is requiring your employees to wash their hands also a rape-like violation of their bodily freedoms?
Serious question - where are the limit lines?

SpiceWolf are you objecting to government mandates or any requirements at all?


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15 Oct 2021, 3:24 pm

Misslizard wrote:
What about seat belt laws and requiring children to ride in car seats?


Or
Voter registration
Drivers licenses
Social security cards
License plates
Vehicle registration
State ID cards
License registration and insurance upon a traffic stop
Required to update all this information if you move
Required to re-register all of this if you move to a new state

SOCIALISM BAD! So don't use roads or sidewalks, or call the police or fire rescue, never go to a library or a park, avoid the internet entirely, drop out of public school, burn your ID, reject money and deal exclusively in rare metals and gems, and don't plan to collect social security.



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16 Oct 2021, 5:31 am

magz wrote:
Is requiring your employees to wash their hands also a rape-like violation of their bodily freedoms?
Serious question - where are the limit lines?


That's a very good question magz, but we can safely say that their *is* a line.
Where that line is, is the very good question.

Just as your boss can require you to wear a uniform at work, but if the boss demanded all the employees come
in naked to work, then the boss would be censured.

So we have established their is a line, uniforms are on one side of that line, but making people work for you naked, is on the other side of that line.

In the same way, I can safely say that, for me, mandating I wash my hands is on one side of the line.
But forcing people to take medication or have surgery to keep their job, is on the other side of that line.
Not just a little bit over the line, way waaaay over the line.