Nobody interested in the Russia-Ukraine conflict?

Page 92 of 106 [ 1685 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 89, 90, 91, 92, 93, 94, 95 ... 106  Next

Mikah
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 23 Oct 2015
Age: 34
Posts: 2,675
Location: England

31 Jul 2022, 10:27 am

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... sia-europe

The rouble is soaring and Putin is stronger than ever - our sanctions have backfired

Western sanctions against Russia are the most ill-conceived and counterproductive policy in recent international history. Military aid to Ukraine is justified, but the economic war is ineffective against the regime in Moscow, and devastating for its unintended targets. World energy prices are rocketing, inflation is soaring, supply chains are chaotic and millions are being starved of gas, grain and fertiliser. Yet Vladimir Putin’s barbarity only escalates – as does his hold over his own people.

...


_________________
Though here at journey's end I lie
in darkness buried deep,
beyond all towers strong and high,
beyond all mountains steep,
above all shadows rides the Sun
and Stars for ever dwell:
I will not say the Day is done,
nor bid the Stars farewell.


ironpony
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 3 Nov 2015
Age: 38
Posts: 5,395
Location: canada

01 Aug 2022, 8:05 pm

Mikah wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/jul/29/putin-ruble-west-sanctions-russia-europe

The rouble is soaring and Putin is stronger than ever - our sanctions have backfired

Western sanctions against Russia are the most ill-conceived and counterproductive policy in recent international history. Military aid to Ukraine is justified, but the economic war is ineffective against the regime in Moscow, and devastating for its unintended targets. World energy prices are rocketing, inflation is soaring, supply chains are chaotic and millions are being starved of gas, grain and fertiliser. Yet Vladimir Putin’s barbarity only escalates – as does his hold over his own people.

...


Well this is how I feel about it too. What's the point of sanctions, when they do not threaten dictators... People said it will bring Putin down, but he only keeps escalating things.

It's like telling a serial killer that they are going to fine him 50 dollars a month, since he keeps on murdering. Most serial killers would think "you mean all I have to do is pay 50 dollars a month and I can keep murdering and you won't do anything else to try to stop me? Sure I'll take deal!".

And the fact that some NATO countries are helping Russians who are trying to leave the country, immigrate to other countries, is actually going to make Putin more powerful, because then Russian people will not be forced to actually deal with the problem, if they are allowed to just escape, and Putin has less people he has to control, thereby giving him more power.



Mikah
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 23 Oct 2015
Age: 34
Posts: 2,675
Location: England

06 Aug 2022, 9:16 am

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/ ... civilians/

Amnesty International here calling out Ukraine for using human shields (that, by the way, is what the media calls it when someone we don't like and support does it).

As usual the "right wing conspiracy theorists" are on the money months before anyone respectable is. These tactics are responsible for the majority of "Russia blows up school/hospital/orphanage" headlines you read.


_________________
Though here at journey's end I lie
in darkness buried deep,
beyond all towers strong and high,
beyond all mountains steep,
above all shadows rides the Sun
and Stars for ever dwell:
I will not say the Day is done,
nor bid the Stars farewell.


ironpony
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 3 Nov 2015
Age: 38
Posts: 5,395
Location: canada

07 Aug 2022, 12:17 am

Well if Russia starts invading other countries it might turn into WW3. However, in WWII, the only way to get Japan to surrender was to invent the atomic bomb. But since Russia has plenty of those, will NATO have to invent a more more effective new weapon of mass destruction that would be equivalent to what the atomic bomb was to Japan in the 50s?



carlos55
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 5 Mar 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,251

07 Aug 2022, 12:14 pm

ironpony wrote:
Well if Russia starts invading other countries it might turn into WW3. However, in WWII, the only way to get Japan to surrender was to invent the atomic bomb. But since Russia has plenty of those, will NATO have to invent a more more effective new weapon of mass destruction that would be equivalent to what the atomic bomb was to Japan in the 50s?


The next stage up from nukes is to use a highly radioactive substance and easy to make cobalt nuke bomb that keeps an area radioactive for many hundreds of years. Up to now all have refrained from doing so as it only takes a modest amount to wipe out all life on earth. However its believed to be used in Russia`s new poseidon drone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANIc4NKj6WQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzEc5d8n95k

After that you have an antimatter bomb that in theory could destroy the earth.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otx3LVDysvk


_________________
"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends upon the unreasonable man."

- George Bernie Shaw


ironpony
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 3 Nov 2015
Age: 38
Posts: 5,395
Location: canada

07 Aug 2022, 1:51 pm

carlos55 wrote:
ironpony wrote:
Well if Russia starts invading other countries it might turn into WW3. However, in WWII, the only way to get Japan to surrender was to invent the atomic bomb. But since Russia has plenty of those, will NATO have to invent a more more effective new weapon of mass destruction that would be equivalent to what the atomic bomb was to Japan in the 50s?


The next stage up from nukes is to use a highly radioactive substance and easy to make cobalt nuke bomb that keeps an area radioactive for many hundreds of years. Up to now all have refrained from doing so as it only takes a modest amount to wipe out all life on earth. However its believed to be used in Russia`s new poseidon drone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANIc4NKj6WQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzEc5d8n95k

After that you have an antimatter bomb that in theory could destroy the earth.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otx3LVDysvk


Oh I see. When you say Cobalt bomb, do you more like a neutron bomb?



nadyia
Butterfly
Butterfly

Joined: 7 Aug 2022
Gender: Female
Posts: 14
Location: Australasia

07 Aug 2022, 2:11 pm

A war that seems to have no end in sight. Plus inflation or famine dawning upon the rest of the world.

I sometimes ask myself:
wouldn't it have been better if Russia was allowed to take Crimea and Donbas? Which are Russian-majority and Russia-friendly anyway.
Or would that concession have emboldened Putin even further, towards occupying other territories?
Hard to judge



Last edited by nadyia on 07 Aug 2022, 2:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

SpiralingCrow
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 20 Apr 2022
Age: 47
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,558

07 Aug 2022, 2:16 pm

The people who live in former communist bloc countries are very afraid that if Putin takes Ukraine or part of it, that it will embolden him to reestablish USSR glory days and retake their countries.



kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 85,100
Location: Queens, NYC

07 Aug 2022, 2:45 pm

Nope…..if Russia is given Carte Blanche to take over territories not theirs, it would embolden Putin. Inspire him, as stated above, to bring back the “glory days” of the USSR.



SkinnedWolf
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Mar 2022
Age: 23
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 1,525
Location: China

07 Aug 2022, 2:59 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Nope…..if Russia is given Carte Blanche to take over territories not theirs, it would embolden Putin. Inspire him, as stated above, to bring back the “glory days” of the USSR.

The official ideology of the Russian Federation is nationalism rather than communism.
Nationalism supports them in their quest for the territory of all the Russian people.
Although the definition of the Russian people may differ from that of other countries. But it is hard to imagine that such differences will even reach ethnic groups that do not belong to the East Slavic people.
Certain lands in eastern Ukraine would indeed be described as belonging to the Russian people before the dissolution of the Soviet Union.


_________________
With the help of translation software.

Cover your eyes, if you like. It will serve no purpose.

You might expect to be able to crush them in your hand, into wolf-bone fragments.
Dance with me, funeralxempire. Into night's circle we fly, until the fire enjoys us.


nadyia
Butterfly
Butterfly

Joined: 7 Aug 2022
Gender: Female
Posts: 14
Location: Australasia

07 Aug 2022, 4:24 pm

The ending of the article, so aptly describes how I feel:

"Meanwhile, the west and its peoples have been plunged into recession. Leadership has been shaken and insecurity spread in Britain, France, Italy and the US. Gas-starved Germany and Hungary are close to dancing to Putin’s tune. Living costs are escalating everywhere. Yet still no one dares question sanctions. It is sacrilege to admit their failure or conceive retreat. The west has been enticed into the timeless irony of aggression. Eventually its most conspicuous victim is the aggressor. Perhaps, after all, we should stick to war."


And mind you, I'm from Eastern Europe originally, my people are anti-Russian, the carnage is terrible. Yet the way this war is affecting our economies, I've become allergic to seeing Zelensky's face everywhere, and to doubt the US.

I keep sliding into a conspiratorial mindset & asking myself: Did Biden (or whatever decision-makers are using him as their face) merely show incompetence when he imposed all those sanctions? Or did he act opportunistically to benefit America, as in "The Shock Doctrine "?

And how come none of the Ukrainian or American oligarchs are suffering material losses, yet we laypeople have to pay?



SkinnedWolf
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Mar 2022
Age: 23
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 1,525
Location: China

07 Aug 2022, 5:50 pm

Mikah wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/jul/29/putin-ruble-west-sanctions-russia-europe

The rouble is soaring and Putin is stronger than ever - our sanctions have backfired

Western sanctions against Russia are the most ill-conceived and counterproductive policy in recent international history. Military aid to Ukraine is justified, but the economic war is ineffective against the regime in Moscow, and devastating for its unintended targets. World energy prices are rocketing, inflation is soaring, supply chains are chaotic and millions are being starved of gas, grain and fertiliser. Yet Vladimir Putin’s barbarity only escalates – as does his hold over his own people.

...

The interdependence of the world’s economies, so long seen as an instrument of peace, has been made a weapon of war. Politicians around the Nato table have been wisely cautious about escalating military aid to Ukraine. They understand military deterrence. Yet they appear total ingenues on economics. Here they all parrot Dr Strangelove. They want to bomb Russia’s economy “back to the stone age”.

I would be intrigued to know if any paper was ever submitted to Boris Johnson’s cabinet forecasting the likely outcome for Britain of Russian sanctions. The assumption seems to be that if trade embargos hurt they are working. As they do not directly kill people, they are somehow an acceptable form of aggression. They are based on a neo-imperial assumption that western countries are entitled to order the world as they wish. They are enforced, if not through gunboats, then through capitalist muscle in a globalised economy. Since they are mostly imposed on small, weak states soon out of the headlines, their purpose has largely been of “feelgood” symbolism.

A rare student of this subject is the American economic historian Nicholas Mulder, who points out that more than 30 sanctions “wars” in the past 50 years have had minimal if not counterproductive impact. They are meant to “intimidate peoples into restraining their princes”. If anything they have had the opposite effect. From Cuba to Korea, Myanmar to Iran, Venezuela to Russia, autocratic regimes have been entrenched, elites strengthened and freedoms crushed. Sanctions seem to instil stability and self-reliance on even their weakest victim. Almost all the world’s oldest dictatorships have benefited from western sanctions.


In a famine, those who lack the most power are the first to die.
This makes all the words like"hate the government but love people" or "save the people from the autocratic regime" so pale.


_________________
With the help of translation software.

Cover your eyes, if you like. It will serve no purpose.

You might expect to be able to crush them in your hand, into wolf-bone fragments.
Dance with me, funeralxempire. Into night's circle we fly, until the fire enjoys us.


kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 85,100
Location: Queens, NYC

07 Aug 2022, 6:49 pm

Zelensky is the person being invaded.

What has he done to disturb someone being turned off by seeing his picture?



nadyia
Butterfly
Butterfly

Joined: 7 Aug 2022
Gender: Female
Posts: 14
Location: Australasia

07 Aug 2022, 9:37 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Zelensky is the person being invaded.

What has he done to disturb someone being turned off by seeing his picture?



good point.
I guess I got carried away emotionally, focusing on superficial things like the Vogue photshoot and Zelensky's buff appearances in camouflage shirts, while Ukrainian soldiers in trenches are covered with pus and lice
Blame it on tone-deaf or strategists who give him the wrong advice how to gather support for Ukraine

Focusing on facts:
I have the sense that massmedia isn't giving us the real story.
Understandably so, we're at war.
But they're doing a piss-poor job at it.

For example, why did Zelensky fire his top men? Why didn't massmedia investigate that further.
Not for one second will I believe that those Ukrainian officials were Russian moles or pro-Russian, as Zelensky insinuated.



SkinnedWolf
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Mar 2022
Age: 23
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 1,525
Location: China

07 Aug 2022, 11:30 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Zelensky is the person being invaded.

What has he done to disturb someone being turned off by seeing his picture?

Ukrainian Communist youth leaders arrested by government, reportedly targeted for death March 7, 2022
Quote:
Mikhail Kononovich, leader of the youth wing of the outlawed Communist Party of Ukraine (CPU), and his brother, Aleksander Kononovich, were arrested by Ukrainian authorities in Kiev and could reportedly be facing execution.

The press office of the Security Service of Ukraine charged the two with being “propagandists” aiming to “destabilize” the internal situation in Ukraine. Essentially, the state accused them of acting as agents for Russia and Belarus, according to information received from the World Federation of Democratic Youth (WFDY), a global organization of progressive youth groups.
...
The government that took power in Ukraine in the wake of the U.S.-backed “Euro-Maidan” coup of 2014 outlawed the Communist Party and banned it from running candidates in elections. The party’s youth group was also made illegal and its members subjected to political persecution by the police and in the courts.

Across the country, the government enforced a so-called “de-communization” law that not only outlawed the CPU, but also forbid the use of any Communist names or symbols in public, mandated the destruction of Soviet war memorials, and prevented any teaching about the positive aspects of Soviet history in schools.
...
In an interview featured in People’s World in November 2019, Mikhail Kononovich—one of the two activists currently being held by the state—discussed Communist Youth Union mobilizations against the privatization of public farmlands by the government of President Volodymyr Zelensky.

After the Soviet Union fell apart in 1990-91, the Ukrainian government abandoned the collective farm system that had defined socialist agriculture in the USSR. The former collectively-owned land was distributed among the members of the farms, however, and bans on further sales were put in place to protect small farmers from being swallowed up by corporate industrial giants.

The Zelensky government reversed that longstanding policy in 2019, leading to fears that Ukrainian farmland—which takes up as much space as France and Germany combined—would be gobbled up by foreign agribusiness giants.

Ukraine is a top wheat producer; together with Russia it accounts for about 30% of the world’s traded wheat. The Russian invasion of Ukraine and the ensuing war have disrupted exports from both countries and sent global wheat prices soaring. International inflation of food prices, already on a steady rise before the war, will certainly be accelerated—leading to higher profits for producers outside the conflict zone.

Mikhail Kononovich situated the government’s persecution of Communists within the context of the neoliberal economic policies of marketization and privatization, such as the land sales, that have been pursued since the coup of 2014.

All through the 1990s and most of the 2000s, the CPU was the largest party in the Ukrainian parliament, and in the last election before it was banned, it received nearly three million votes. It often stood as a roadblock to multiple governments’ attempts to sell off more of the public property and resources inherited from Soviet socialism.

Kononovich said the outlawing of the CPU was intended “to clear the political field of left parties so they would not interfere with lowering social standards and selling land.” Comparing the fight to the resistance against Nazi invaders during World War II, Kononovich said, “The sale of [public] land is our Stalingrad—not one step back! No sale of land!”

The Kononovich family has been repeatedly targeted by both state authorities and fascist militia forces. According to a filing on record with the European Parliament, while leaving flowers in 2016 at a monument to Red Army soldiers who fought against Hitler, Mikhail Kononovich and other members of the Komsomol were victims of an assault by right-wing militants. Kononovich suffered serious blows to the head and another member nearly lost his sight.

Fascist gangs attempted to pressure hospital staff not to treat the injured Communists and also regularly intimidated Kononovich’s wife and daughter at their home afterward.

As of press time, the status of the two brothers, Mikhail and Aleksander Kononovich, and the conditions under which they are being held are not known.

Information from the CPU remains difficult to obtain due to the fighting in and around Kiev and because the party’s website and electronic communications channels have been blocked by the government since just after the war began.


_________________
With the help of translation software.

Cover your eyes, if you like. It will serve no purpose.

You might expect to be able to crush them in your hand, into wolf-bone fragments.
Dance with me, funeralxempire. Into night's circle we fly, until the fire enjoys us.


nadyia
Butterfly
Butterfly

Joined: 7 Aug 2022
Gender: Female
Posts: 14
Location: Australasia

08 Aug 2022, 12:23 am

lol lonewolf, are you seconding me? :lol:
You crack me up
I love this site already, you guys skinnedwolf and kraftiekortie are practicing true free speech and fostering exciting debates.

skinnedwolf, imo you're totally right, Ukraine, the most corrupt EE country, just like the West, is falling into the neofeudal transfer of wealth and farmland to the one per cent
--- but a quote endorsing a Communist party??? I'm not sure it's good either

I would be keen for other posters --who are more versed in Politics, than I am-- addressed your posts as wwll