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klanka
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21 May 2022, 1:21 pm

I started taking St.John's Wort, it had some interesting results:

Cons:
When I'm on it I can't do any coding on the computer, I get put into a 'zombiefied' state.
When first starting taking it I left food in the oven and left the house, luckily someone else in the house turned the oven off.Thankfully that absent mindedness fades with time. The inability to code hasn't faded.

Pros:
I had a positive comment from a woman saying that I was more manly on our date than usual. I had taken 2 pills before.
Not being depressed.
St.Johns is relatively cheap and you dont have to go to the doctors.
Doesnt have other side effects of other SSRI's such as dry mouth,insomnia.



DanielW
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21 May 2022, 1:45 pm

klanka wrote:
I started taking St.John's Wort, it had some interesting results:

Cons:
When I'm on it I can't do any coding on the computer, I get put into a 'zombiefied' state.
When first starting taking it I left food in the oven and left the house, luckily someone else in the house turned the oven off.Thankfully that absent mindedness fades with time. The inability to code hasn't faded.

Pros:
I had a positive comment from a woman saying that I was more manly on our date than usual. I had taken 2 pills before.
Not being depressed.
St.Johns is relatively cheap and you dont have to go to the doctors.
Doesnt have other side effects of other SSRI's such as dry mouth,insomnia.


Sounds awful, not like a better alternative. It may not have the side-effects, but it doesn't have the therapeutic ones either. If I lost my mental faculties (like being un-able to code) It stop taking it immediately.



klanka
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21 May 2022, 1:53 pm

which therapeutic effects do you think the St.John's is missing?

I was on Paxil before, taking a very low dose. I could code I think, but I had a stable relationship at the same time...so if I just took that tiny dose it might not work now.



steve30
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21 May 2022, 8:20 pm

Sounds interesting. I've pondered trying St Johns Wart, but never bothered.

I read somewhere that there can be differences in quality between different manufacturers. Is this something anyone here has noticed?



Sarahsmith
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21 May 2022, 8:25 pm

When I took it I felt anxious. I suppose it improved mood but in a weird way. Kind of like taking an anti depressant would I guess.



Fnord
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21 May 2022, 9:07 pm

Coincidentally, I have been reading up on herbal practices of Native American Peoples, and found this bit of information:

Medical Research:

The active chemicals that were found in St. Johns Wort were choline, pectin, rutin, sitosterol, hypericin, and pseudohypericin. Since 1988, hypericin has been researched for AIDS treatment as a sedative, anti-inflamatory, and antibacterial drug. Also, it has reduced fever, decreased swelling of lymph nodes, improved appetites, and increased the energy of AIDS patients (Foster and Duke, 190). However, it was not a cure. Recent research has indicated immune-stimulating chemicals and anti-bacterial, anti-fungal, and anti-inflammatory activity. In laboratory experiments when mice infected with the leukemia virus were injected with an extract of St. Johns Wort, they did not develop the disease. When given orally, it was equally effective. HIV-infected mice had similar results. Side effects included skin burns, rashes, and blistering because of the chemical hypericin (James,1989). Further research was needed for HIV and leukemia treatments of St. Johns Wort. Other studies supported the herb's use for wound-healing and reduction of wound infections (Meuelo,198). Milspaugh (1892) reported the ingested plant sometimes caused mental depression, exhaustion, confusion, pupil dilation, increased heartbeats, numbness, and shivering.

AUTHOR: Schafer, Patricia D.
TITLE: A Manual of Cherokee Herbal Remedies: History, Information, Identification, Medicinal Healing. Mar 1993, 292p.; Master's Thesis, Indiana State University.



klanka
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22 May 2022, 2:26 am

Thanks for that fnord.

I could experiment a bit with different manufacturers I spose, next time I could buy a different brand.

I tried coming off it but just got depressed so....maybe if my life situation improved I could see what happens if I stop taking it.

I'm applying for jobs etc,



aajiplanet
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22 May 2022, 6:21 am

Sounds bad, but the situation is critical to handle.



DanielW
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22 May 2022, 8:46 am

klanka wrote:
which therapeutic effects do you think the St.John's is missing?

I was on Paxil before, taking a very low dose. I could code I think, but I had a stable relationship at the same time...so if I just took that tiny dose it might not work now.


The trouble with supplements is getting a standardized dose. In testing, various preparations of St John's wort did something like 18% better than a placebo, but was 6% less effective than a tricyclic anti-depressant. The active substance in St. john's wort (hypericum) has never been compared with SSRI's in any large studies. There is evidence to show that women with mild depression did equally as well with 900 mg of hypericum as they did with 50 mg of Sertraline in a 6 week trial.

That, said, if it work fo you, that's great.



ThisTimelessMoment
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22 May 2022, 11:05 am

I found some relief from depression with st Johns wort. That's just an anecdote. Could just as easily have been a placebo effect. Or a combination of placebo and a chemical effect. Impossible to tell with study with a cohort of one!
Another option I found useful was 5HTP. The same caveats apply as above.
I have never been that enthusiastic on taking supplements (or anything) for too long at a stretch. But that depends on how much something is needed.


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klanka
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22 May 2022, 11:37 am

DanielW wrote:
klanka wrote:
which therapeutic effects do you think the St.John's is missing?

I was on Paxil before, taking a very low dose. I could code I think, but I had a stable relationship at the same time...so if I just took that tiny dose it might not work now.


The trouble with supplements is getting a standardized dose. In testing, various preparations of St John's wort did something like 18% better than a placebo, but was 6% less effective than a tricyclic anti-depressant. The active substance in St. john's wort (hypericum) has never been compared with SSRI's in any large studies. There is evidence to show that women with mild depression did equally as well with 900 mg of hypericum as they did with 50 mg of Sertraline in a 6 week trial.

That, said, if it work fo you, that's great.


I suppose I could be taking too much if im being zombiefied. I once took 3 pills to see what it was like and zoned out for three days :mrgreen: it was like a 3 day holiday. I dont think i'll do it again cos of the cooking issue.



ToughDiamond
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22 May 2022, 1:31 pm

Fnord wrote:
Milspaugh (1892) reported the ingested plant sometimes caused mental depression

:lol:



klanka
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22 May 2022, 1:40 pm

ToughDiamond wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Milspaugh (1892) reported the ingested plant sometimes caused mental depression

:lol:


I think one side effect of SSRI's like paxil is also depression :)

It is insane tho yeah



ToughDiamond
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22 May 2022, 1:47 pm

If you've found a happy pill that kind of works for you, fine. In my case I'd rather work on the causes of my feeling down, though it doesn't look as if I've ever been clinically depressed, and when I'm unhappy there are usually external reasons for it - so my own situation might be very different from that of many people. Having said that, I've long suspected that many people tend to overmedicalise their physical and mental problems, and to see themselves as unhealthy rather than looking at how their environment or lifestyle is impacting on them.

If I was far gone enough to consider antidepressants, I'd prefer herbal ones as a first resort, though I'm not convinced that herbal medicines are always safe or effective. Pharmaceutical antidepressants would be a last resort. I'd only try them if I were desperate, and even then, with little hope of benefit. I can't vouch for this paper, but I wouldn't be surprised if there was some truth in it:
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10 ... 00275/full