Biden considering EOs to preserve Roe

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Tim_Tex
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09 Jun 2022, 1:58 pm

https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/09/politics/biden-executive-actions-roe-v-wade/index.html

I have also wondered if a national referendum could be held.



r00tb33r
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09 Jun 2022, 3:41 pm

Here's my problem with it. Roe v. Wade is a known fraudulent case. It establishes an important legal precedent, but why would you prop up a whole legal doctrine on a case invalidated by fraud? The case isn't unique. A better case should be sent to SCOTUS to replace Roe v. Wade with. That's the solution.

Sure, a referendum is an option, but here comes the debate. Should men be voting in it? (and all the other problems that come with that)



kitesandtrainsandcats
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09 Jun 2022, 4:20 pm

r00tb33r wrote:
Sure, a referendum is an option, but here comes the debate. Should men be voting in it? (and all the other problems that come with that)


How about this question:

Should anyone who could have been aborted be allowed to vote in it?


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r00tb33r
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09 Jun 2022, 4:24 pm

kitesandtrainsandcats wrote:
r00tb33r wrote:
Sure, a referendum is an option, but here comes the debate. Should men be voting in it? (and all the other problems that come with that)


How about this question:

Should anyone who could have been aborted be allowed to vote in it?

All valid points. I don't have a good read on what's going to happen.



kitesandtrainsandcats
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09 Jun 2022, 4:30 pm

Remember that overturning the ruling doesn't ban abortion across the board, it returns decision power to state governments.

Here is a reference:

Overturning Roe would hand power over abortion to states. Many would ban it.
26 U.S. states are poised to immediately ban the procedure or place severe restrictions on it, including many in the South and Midwest
By: Jacob Fischler and Ariana Figueroa - May 3, 2022 5:37 pm
https://idahocapitalsun.com/2022/05/03/ ... ld-ban-it/
"
If made final, the court opinion would create a patchwork of legal abortion access across the country by leaving policymaking to the states, 26 of which are poised to immediately ban the procedure or place severe restrictions on it, according to an analysis from the Guttmacher Institute, a pro-reproductive rights research group.
"
...

"
Even with Roe in place, not all pregnant patients have had equal access to abortion, said Derek Siegel, a Ph.D. candidate in sociology at the University of Massachusetts-Amherst who studies race, gender and reproduction. Siegel uses they/them pronouns.

“Roe v. Wade has never been a reality for most people in the U.S.,” they said. “Abortions are extremely expensive because of the Hyde amendment prohibiting federal funds to going towards abortion. That doesn’t even include travel, lodging and child care costs.”

The Hyde Amendment has been attached to federal funding bills every year since 1977 to prevent the use of Medicaid funds for abortion care, except in extreme cases.
"

:arrow: Note that in the US's style of Federal government the states have individual power themselves.

Two references,

https://www.whitehouse.gov/about-the-wh ... overnment/
"
State & Local Government

Under the Tenth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, all powers not granted to the Federal Government are reserved for the States and the people. All State Governments are modeled after the Federal Government and consist of three branches: executive, legislative, and judicial. The U.S. Constitution mandates that all states uphold a “republican form” of government, although the three-branch structure is not required.
"


https://www.whitehouse.gov/about-the-wh ... overnment/
"
Powers not granted to the Federal government are reserved for States and the people, which are divided between State and local governments.

Most Americans have more frequent contact with their State and local governments than with the Federal Government. Police departments, libraries, and schools—not to mention driver’s licenses and parking tickets—usually fall under the oversight of State and local governments. Each state has its own written constitution, and these documents are often far more elaborate than their Federal counterpart. The Alabama Constitution, for example, contains 310,296 words—more than 40 times as many as the U.S. Constitution.

All State governments are modeled after the Federal Government and consist of three branches: executive, legislative, and judicial. The U.S. Constitution mandates that all States uphold a “republican form” of government, although the three-branch structure is not required.
"

See also: :arrow:
"
Intro.6.2.3 Federalism and the Constitution

Another basic concept embodied in the Constitution is federalism, which refers to the division and sharing of power between the national and state governments.1 By allocating power among state and federal governments, the Framers sought to establish a unified national government of limited powers while maintaining a distinct sphere of autonomy in which state governments could exercise a general police power.2 Although the Framers' sought to preserve liberty by diffusing power,3 Justices and scholars have noted that federalism has other advantages,4 including that it allows individual states to experiment with novel government programs as "laboratories of democracy"5 and increases the accountability of elected government officials to citizens.6

Although the text of the Constitution does not clearly delineate many of the boundaries between the powers of the federal and state governments, the Supreme Court has frequently invoked certain constitutional provisions when determining that Congress has exceeded its constitutional powers and infringed upon state sovereignty.7 One well-known provision, regarded by the Court as both a shield and sword to thwart federal encroachment, is the Tenth Amendment, which provides that "the powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people." In modern times, the Court has vacillated8 between the view that the Tenth Amendment operates to restrict Congress' power9 and the view that the amendment is a mere "truism"10 that cannot be used to strike down federal statutes.11 Other notable provisions addressing Congress' power relative to the states that the Court has debated include the Supremacy Clause in Article VI, which establishes federal law as superior to state law;12 the Commerce Clause in Article I, Section 8, Clause 3, which grants Congress the authority to legislate on matters concerning interstate commerce;13 and Section 5 of the Fourteenth Amendment, which grants Congress the power to enforce that Amendment's guarantees against the states through the enactment of appropriate legislation.14 More broadly, federalism principles also undergird many Supreme Court decisions interpreting individual rights and the extent to which the Court should federalize, for example, the rights afforded to state criminal defendants.15 But judges and scholars disagree on how basic principles of federalism should be realized, and a key point of controversy is whether the judiciary should enforce the interests of the states against the federal government or leave the resolution of such key questions about the relationship between federal and state power to the political process.16
"
https://constitution.congress.gov/brows ... _00000032/


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Persephone29
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09 Jun 2022, 5:55 pm

But no EO to put protection in schools? Odd... ( but predictable ).


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kitesandtrainsandcats
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09 Jun 2022, 6:05 pm

Persephone29 wrote:
But no EO to put protection in schools? Odd... ( but predictable ).


Minority populations are not real thrilled by the idea of more police in schools.
For instance;


School Climate & Safety
The Risks and Benefits of School Police: Black and Latino Parents Weigh In
By Eesha Pendharkar — June 08, 2022 8 min read
https://www.edweek.org/leadership/the-r ... in/2022/06

"
Khulia Pringle, a Black parent in the Minneapolis-St. Paul area of Minnesota, works with several national organizations including Dignity in Schools to get rid of police in schools. A former teacher and current activist, she has been advocating for the removal of SROs from Minneapolis and St. Paul schools (which the districts did in 2020 after the police killing of George Floyd in that community unleashed protests across the country).

“Black and brown parents for years have been asking for police-free schools, and when we speak our voices are unheard,” she said. “But when other folks speak their voices are heard and their voices are elevated, and the consequences are these knee-jerk reactionary policies that ultimately affect folks that are already oppressed.”
"

See also:

Race Matters
Students of Color Reject Calls For Increasing Police Presence In Schools
Over 200 instances of officers assaulting students of color have been noted, according to the Advancement Project
By Murjani Rawls
Monday 2:59PM
Comments (5)
Alerts
https://www.theroot.com/students-of-col ... 1849024502

"
Researchers note Black students feel less safe around police officers than white peers, and officers in predominately Black school districts are most likely to look at the students as threats. The ACLU shows Black, and Latino boys with disabilities represent only three percent of students nationally but account for 12 percent of school arrests. Since 2007, there have been over 200 instances of officers assaulting students of color, The Advancement Project shows.

The director of the Opportunity to Learn program at the Advancement Project, Katherine Dunn, spoke to the Associated Press on how nerve-wracking a school day could be to a person of color if this continues.

“It shows all the physical harms that young people experience by police,” she said. “It’s also the experience of being degraded and made to feel like a criminal because you have to walk down the hallway to your class with several armed cops, who are not there for your safety, who you see arrest your friends, assault your friends.”
"


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ASPartOfMe
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09 Jun 2022, 6:41 pm

There are no laws allowing for nationwide referendums.

Any executive orders will be challenged in court and with this SCOTUS would probably be successfull.


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