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IsabellaLinton
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26 Aug 2022, 4:54 pm

Fnord wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
Fnord wrote:
The cowardice exhibited by the Uvalde police chief was a conscious choice -- not a mistake -- while the accidental administration of a fatal drug is just that -- accidental.
Usually, yes.  Some psycho doctors or nurses do it on purpose but most are mistakes.  There's no mistake if you're the chief of police.  Sorry I wasn't ranting at you, Fnord.
You are correct, of course.

Psychos seem to exist in every profession.  Sadly, such people also seem to take pleasure in hurting others or allowing other people to get hurt.  In this respect, the Uvalde chief of police was on par with the shooter -- one observed the other commit murder, and acted only when the shooter ran out of victims.




and they knowingly stopped others from helping -- including parents and armed border security cops.

"Oh gee, we thought they were all dead already so there was no point going in .... "

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kraftiekortie
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26 Aug 2022, 4:54 pm

This wasn't a fire.

There was one gunman. There were many cops. The cops should have done something. Period.



IsabellaLinton
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26 Aug 2022, 5:00 pm

Nades wrote:
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I didn't say throw him in prison for the rest of his life (as much as I'd love that.)
I said charge him.

Let him get a lawyer and defend his actions against his job title.
Then if he is found guilty by a jury of his peers, let him face sentencing.

This isn't a case of "shite happens".

It was a calculated decision not to do his job.
That's why he was fired, so it's already been determined that he didn't do the right thing.


The charges you said he should face, especially multiple counts of murder usually carry a mandatory life sentence. Multiple charges of manslaughter while much lesser is also dealt with in a trigger happy manner by US courts.

In response to you fire post, firemen actually do refuse to go inside burning buildings if the risks are too high even if other lives are in serious danger.


Firefighters still fight the fire from outside, if their lives are at risk.
These cops didn't fight the man from outside.
They did nothing.

Holy crap, do you actually think I might feel sorry for him or any other POS who is paid to protect children but allows them to die whilst they're begging for help?

Do you think I can't do simple math?

There was one gunman and countless numbers of police officers who should have approached from multiple angles.



Nades
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26 Aug 2022, 5:03 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
This wasn't a fire.



Exactly. Poor analogy to use.

This was a very human event. The froze on the spot. Is a coward? Yes. Should he face a lengthy sentence? Probably not.

Lets be honest. Everyone talking the talk here would never walk the walk in the same shoes too.



kraftiekortie
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26 Aug 2022, 5:04 pm

Those cops should have thought that it was THEIR kids who were in those classrooms being shot at by the gunman.



Nades
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26 Aug 2022, 5:09 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Those cops should have thought that it was THEIR kids who were in those classrooms being shot at by the gunman.


But they were not.

I'm impressed how blinkered everyone is here to human psychology. The human desire for self preservation and to not run into danger is strong in almost everyone. How strong that desire is can only truly be found at times like this and it turns out his was on the strong end. He didn't have the slightest clue he would freeze on the spot and have a borderline meltdown.



IsabellaLinton
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26 Aug 2022, 5:15 pm

Nades wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
This wasn't a fire.



Exactly. Poor analogy to use.

This was a very human event. The froze on the spot. Is a coward? Yes. Should he face a lengthy sentence? Probably not.

Lets be honest. Everyone talking the talk here would never walk the walk in the same shoes too.


Don't speak so fast.
I didn't choose to be a police officer or to risk my life for strangers.
That being said I've risked my life for my children, with an armed psycho.
I've physically attacked an armed psycho.
If someone was threatening my children in that school, I likely would have killed the cops.
I know that's not logical, but that's my mama bear instinct.

I can understand a cop hesitating and not killing a perp instantaneously.
I can understand taking him out by the legs, or using a taser.

I can't understand a whole group taking orders to do nothing.
They stood there for over an hour.

It's not like the guy was bombing the building or moving room to room.



kraftiekortie
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26 Aug 2022, 5:16 pm

I understand the desire for "self-preservation." I feel it.

But these were ARMED COPS....with at least basic training on how to deal with these situations.

There was only one gunman.

The leader of the group should have devised a PLAN OF ACTION. If they did, it's at least possible that they could have avoided deaths.



funeralxempire
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26 Aug 2022, 5:46 pm

Nades wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
This wasn't a fire.



Exactly. Poor analogy to use.

This was a very human event. The froze on the spot. Is a coward? Yes. Should he face a lengthy sentence? Probably not.

Lets be honest. Everyone talking the talk here would never walk the walk in the same shoes too.


He shouldn't work in law enforcement again, some people aren't suited.

If this is one's response:

Nades wrote:
He didn't have the slightest clue he would freeze on the spot and have a borderline meltdown.


they are not suited to be a cop and ought to be fired, they're literally just in the way.


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League_Girl
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26 Aug 2022, 5:51 pm

Being a cop isn't for everyone.


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26 Aug 2022, 7:31 pm

They took an oath .Serve and protect.They did neither , dereliction of duty.
If it was the military and they showed cowardice like that ,they would be punished.


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IsabellaLinton
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26 Aug 2022, 7:33 pm

Nades wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
This wasn't a fire.



Exactly. Poor analogy to use.


Poor analogy?

It's an analogy about first responders who are highly trained, and paid with tax payers' money to save the lives of people in danger by putting their own lives at risk, using specialised protective equipment.



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26 Aug 2022, 8:48 pm

I actually find the inaction to be incredibly shocking, not because I have a lot of confidence in the police but because I don't know an adult man who wouldn't throw himself between a child and harm, it's damn near instinctive (I have it and I don't particularly like children). The thought of just standing there geared up and letting it happen is beyond horrifying, I think I'd rather get shot than do that.


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IsabellaLinton
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26 Aug 2022, 8:49 pm

Dox47 wrote:
I actually find the inaction to be incredibly shocking, not because I have a lot of confidence in the police but because I don't know an adult man who wouldn't throw himself between a child and harm, it's damn near instinctive (I have it and I don't particularly like children). The thought of just standing there geared up and letting it happen is beyond horrifying, I think I'd rather get shot than do that.


Word.



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26 Aug 2022, 9:10 pm

IsabellaLinton wrote:
Dox47 wrote:
I actually find the inaction to be incredibly shocking, not because I have a lot of confidence in the police but because I don't know an adult man who wouldn't throw himself between a child and harm, it's damn near instinctive (I have it and I don't particularly like children). The thought of just standing there geared up and letting it happen is beyond horrifying, I think I'd rather get shot than do that.
Word.
Seconded.


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Raptor
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26 Aug 2022, 11:18 pm

IsabellaLinton wrote:
Fnord wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
Fnord wrote:
The cowardice exhibited by the Uvalde police chief was a conscious choice -- not a mistake -- while the accidental administration of a fatal drug is just that -- accidental.
Usually, yes.  Some psycho doctors or nurses do it on purpose but most are mistakes.  There's no mistake if you're the chief of police.  Sorry I wasn't ranting at you, Fnord.
You are correct, of course.

Psychos seem to exist in every profession.  Sadly, such people also seem to take pleasure in hurting others or allowing other people to get hurt.  In this respect, the Uvalde chief of police was on par with the shooter -- one observed the other commit murder, and acted only when the shooter ran out of victims.




and they knowingly stopped others from helping -- including parents and armed border security cops.

"Oh gee, we thought they were all dead already so there was no point going in .... "

Image


Needs a donut for the other hand.


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