Teacher gets $95,000 settlement for refusing to use pronouns

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Matrix Glitch
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05 Sep 2022, 6:14 am

"A Kansas teacher will receive a $95,000 settlement after she was suspended for refusing to use a student's preferred name and pronouns

former teacher in Kansas will get $95,000 in a settlement after she was suspended for refusing to use a student's preferred name and pronouns.

Pamela Ricard — a former math strategies elective teacher at Fort Riley Middle School in Fort Riley, Kansas who retired in May, according to the school website — sued Geary County Schools in March over her suspension. The school agreed to pay her $95,000 in damages and attorneys' fees, and the lawsuit was dismissed on Wednesday.
"

https://www.businessinsider.com/teacher ... 2022-9?amp



kraftiekortie
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05 Sep 2022, 6:32 am

Why can’t the teacher just use the preferred pronouns for the student? Would make life a lot easier.

It’s not a cardinal sin for a boy to want to be a girl. And vice versa. It certainly makes for a harder life, though. Why make it tougher for this person?



Matrix Glitch
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05 Sep 2022, 8:50 am

My guess is the number of kids wanting to be a different gender, of the many genders available, is skyrocketing.



Dox47
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05 Sep 2022, 12:46 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Why can’t the teacher just use the preferred pronouns for the student? Would make life a lot easier.

It’s not a cardinal sin for a boy to want to be a girl. And vice versa. It certainly makes for a harder life, though. Why make it tougher for this person?


Sometimes a line needs to be drawn. This kind of reminds me of the thing that made Jordan Peterson famous, his position was that he'd use preferred pronouns out of politeness, but strongly objected to it being mandated, and he was absolutely vilified for that. I can see why more people are just saying no, I'm not going to do that.


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05 Sep 2022, 1:15 pm

Teacher only won because religion is a protected class but what if Kansas has laws that protected transgender students? This would be interesting to hear such case. What to do when both laws clash against each other.


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05 Sep 2022, 1:32 pm

Thread title is misleading. Guaranteed this teacher spoke using pronouns. They simply opted not to use the ones preferred by a student in order to be disrespectful to them and their gender identity.


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goldfish21
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05 Sep 2022, 1:38 pm

Matrix Glitch wrote:
My guess is the number of kids wanting to be a different gender, of the many genders available, is skyrocketing.


I doubt either are skyrocketing.

The rate of transgenderism amongst US adults is 0.5%, and amongst youth 13-17 google says it's 1.4%. Are there actually different rates? My money would be on no, not really, there are just more young people comfortable with coming out due to societal shifts in acceptance of lgbt people.

As for the number of genders, there may be more acknowledged.. and on a % basis compared to the colonial binary system of only 2, it may appear to be statistically skyrocketing.. but in absolute numbers, no, I personally wouldn't say it is. Even the % basis would be based on modern society accepting the gender definitions of multiple Indigenous populations from hundreds of years ago, anyways. As per:

Quote:
August 4th 1990, the term "Two-Spirit", for Indigenous people "who embody diverse (or non-normative) sexualities, genders, gender roles, and/or gender expressions", was adopted at the 3rd Annual Gathering of Native American Gays and Lesbians being held near Beausejour, Manitoba, Canada.
Teacher, counselor, administrator, mentor and elder, Dr. Myra Laramee (First Nations Cree) brought the term to a sharing circle of 80 Indigenous LGBT+ people from across North America at the 1990 Gathering, and it was quickly adopted.
As Harlan Pruden, the managing editor of the Two-Spirit Journal, put it: "[Two-Spirit evokes] the time before the harshness of colonisation where many, not all, First Peoples had traditions and ways that were non-binary, where some Nations had 3, 4, 5, 6, or even 7+ different genders and these genders were not only accepted and honoured but also had distinct roles within their respective Nations. Today, we would generally refer to these individuals as Two-Spirit.”
Pictured: We'wha, c1886. We'wha was a Zuni lhamana, who are people with typically male bodies who take on at least some social and ceremonial roles of women, and sometimes wear women's clothes. Some lhamana today identify as Two-Spirit.
Source: Working Class History


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goldfish21
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05 Sep 2022, 1:49 pm

Dox47 wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
Why can’t the teacher just use the preferred pronouns for the student? Would make life a lot easier.

It’s not a cardinal sin for a boy to want to be a girl. And vice versa. It certainly makes for a harder life, though. Why make it tougher for this person?


Sometimes a line needs to be drawn. This kind of reminds me of the thing that made Jordan Peterson famous, his position was that he'd use preferred pronouns out of politeness, but strongly objected to it being mandated, and he was absolutely vilified for that. I can see why more people are just saying no, I'm not going to do that.

Because they feel entitled to make life miserable for trans people? :?

Thankfully gender identity is one of the protected classes of people under the BC Human Rights Code and that crap doesn’t fly in places of employment here.


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goldfish21
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05 Sep 2022, 1:50 pm

League_Girl wrote:
Teacher only won because religion is a protected class but what if Kansas has laws that protected transgender students? This would be interesting to hear such case. What to do when both laws clash against each other.

What religion is anti-trans? :?


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DanielW
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05 Sep 2022, 1:53 pm

All a person has to do if they are confused or just don't want to use pronouns or neo-pronouns is call a student by their name. If THAT is too difficult, they shouldn't be teaching. It really is that simple.



Matrix Glitch
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05 Sep 2022, 1:55 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Thread title is misleading. Guaranteed this teacher spoke using pronouns. They simply opted not to use the ones preferred by a student in order to be disrespectful to them and their gender identity.


I had to abbreviate the title because the title of the article, "A Kansas teacher will receive a $95,000 settlement after she was suspended for refusing to use a student's preferred name and pronouns" wouldn't fit.



Matrix Glitch
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05 Sep 2022, 1:59 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Matrix Glitch wrote:
My guess is the number of kids wanting to be a different gender, of the many genders available, is skyrocketing.


I doubt either are skyrocketing.

The rate of transgenderism amongst US adults is 0.5%, and amongst youth 13-17 google says it's 1.4%. Are there actually different rates? My money would be on no, not really, there are just more young people comfortable with coming out due to societal shifts in acceptance of lgbt people.

As for the number of genders, there may be more acknowledged.. and on a % basis compared to the colonial binary system of only 2, it may appear to be statistically skyrocketing.. but in absolute numbers, no, I personally wouldn't say it is. Even the % basis would be based on modern society accepting the gender definitions of multiple Indigenous populations from hundreds of years ago, anyways. As per:

Quote:
August 4th 1990, the term "Two-Spirit", for Indigenous people "who embody diverse (or non-normative) sexualities, genders, gender roles, and/or gender expressions", was adopted at the 3rd Annual Gathering of Native American Gays and Lesbians being held near Beausejour, Manitoba, Canada.
Teacher, counselor, administrator, mentor and elder, Dr. Myra Laramee (First Nations Cree) brought the term to a sharing circle of 80 Indigenous LGBT+ people from across North America at the 1990 Gathering, and it was quickly adopted.
As Harlan Pruden, the managing editor of the Two-Spirit Journal, put it: "[Two-Spirit evokes] the time before the harshness of colonisation where many, not all, First Peoples had traditions and ways that were non-binary, where some Nations had 3, 4, 5, 6, or even 7+ different genders and these genders were not only accepted and honoured but also had distinct roles within their respective Nations. Today, we would generally refer to these individuals as Two-Spirit.”
Pictured: We'wha, c1886. We'wha was a Zuni lhamana, who are people with typically male bodies who take on at least some social and ceremonial roles of women, and sometimes wear women's clothes. Some lhamana today identify as Two-Spirit.
Source: Working Class History

I've noticed that places on the internet that allow a choice of several genders, most people under 21 have "non-binary' or something else other than male and female. The younger the person is, the more that's the case.



goldfish21
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05 Sep 2022, 2:04 pm

Matrix Glitch wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Matrix Glitch wrote:
My guess is the number of kids wanting to be a different gender, of the many genders available, is skyrocketing.


I doubt either are skyrocketing.

The rate of transgenderism amongst US adults is 0.5%, and amongst youth 13-17 google says it's 1.4%. Are there actually different rates? My money would be on no, not really, there are just more young people comfortable with coming out due to societal shifts in acceptance of lgbt people.

As for the number of genders, there may be more acknowledged.. and on a % basis compared to the colonial binary system of only 2, it may appear to be statistically skyrocketing.. but in absolute numbers, no, I personally wouldn't say it is. Even the % basis would be based on modern society accepting the gender definitions of multiple Indigenous populations from hundreds of years ago, anyways. As per:

Quote:
August 4th 1990, the term "Two-Spirit", for Indigenous people "who embody diverse (or non-normative) sexualities, genders, gender roles, and/or gender expressions", was adopted at the 3rd Annual Gathering of Native American Gays and Lesbians being held near Beausejour, Manitoba, Canada.
Teacher, counselor, administrator, mentor and elder, Dr. Myra Laramee (First Nations Cree) brought the term to a sharing circle of 80 Indigenous LGBT+ people from across North America at the 1990 Gathering, and it was quickly adopted.
As Harlan Pruden, the managing editor of the Two-Spirit Journal, put it: "[Two-Spirit evokes] the time before the harshness of colonisation where many, not all, First Peoples had traditions and ways that were non-binary, where some Nations had 3, 4, 5, 6, or even 7+ different genders and these genders were not only accepted and honoured but also had distinct roles within their respective Nations. Today, we would generally refer to these individuals as Two-Spirit.”
Pictured: We'wha, c1886. We'wha was a Zuni lhamana, who are people with typically male bodies who take on at least some social and ceremonial roles of women, and sometimes wear women's clothes. Some lhamana today identify as Two-Spirit.
Source: Working Class History

It seems to me that places on the internet that allow a choice of several genders, most people under 21 have "non-binary' or something else other than male and female.

If you’re perceiving that And it’s actually happening anywhere on the internet then my best guess is that younger people are selecting nb in solidarity with nb folks & in protest towards hateful bigots, much like when Swedes called in gay to work in the 1970’s to have being homosexual removed from a list of mental illnesses. Not that many people are actually trans/nb just like not that many Swedes were actually gay, but they’re making a point to hateful people - and if you’re noticing; it’s working. :)


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05 Sep 2022, 2:06 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Because they feel entitled to make life miserable for trans people? :?


If you continue to deliberately mischaracterize my posts, I'm going to treat it as trolling and act accordingly.


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05 Sep 2022, 2:19 pm

Dox47 wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Because they feel entitled to make life miserable for trans people? :?


If you continue to deliberately mischaracterize my posts, I'm going to treat it as trolling and act accordingly.

It's a legitimate question.

Why refuse the most basics of polite communications with people?

Do you intentionally misgender anyone else when you know, or assume, what their preferred pronouns are? Do you refer to cis-gendered males as Miss or Mrs? Do you call your mother Sir? My guess is no, so why not extend the same courtesy to others and simply refer to them as they identify?


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05 Sep 2022, 3:31 pm

Matrix Glitch wrote:
My guess is the number of kids wanting to be a different gender, of the many genders available, is skyrocketing.

I’m a teacher and have not seen that at all.

“Skyrocketing” is a huge exaggeration.

Teachers should use the correct pronouns if they want to foster a friendly and inclusive environment for their students.


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